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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 8 of 8. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Phillipa on August 24, 2010, at 17:07:49
. Another article on ketamine being now developed for bipolar depression at Yale In Hartford CT. This will be an oral form and it works fast!!!! no waiting. Phillipa
'Party drug' for depression?
Known to some as 'Special K', ketamine could be developed into a safe medication.
Stories
'Party' Drug May Help With Bipolar Depression
The Hartford Courant
August 19, 2010
Yale researchers hope to develop a form of ketamine an effective but very dangerous antidepressant that's safe, easy to use and effective within hours of taking it.
A new study sheds light on how the drug affects operations in the brain, and why it works so fast compared to other antidepressants. The study was led by Ronald Duman, a professor of psychiatry and pharmacology at Yale, and George Aghajanian, professor of pharmacology. It will be published Friday in the journal Science.
The most popular antidepressants like Prozac and Zoloft, which are selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRI), can take weeks before patients feel their effects. Saying that it's "like a magic drug," Duman notes that one dose of ketamine works fast and can last for up to 10 days
"Clearly, there is a need for a ketamine-like drug with rapid results," he said. Adding to its benefits is that studies indicate that about 70 percent of patients who are resistant to other antidepressants respond to ketamine.Ketamine was developed in the early 1960s and used as an anaesthetic, commonly for soldiers in Vietnam. In the 1990s, it gained a reputation as a "party drug" (known as "Special K") and has been known to cause short-term psychotic symptoms.
For about 10 years, its potential as an antidepressant has been known. Because of its potency, though, it is only administered intraveneously in clinical settings, which significantly limits its use. It's usually prescribed in low doses for patients suffering severe depression who have been resistant to other treatments.
With new information about how it works, though, Duman believes a form of ketamine could be developed that's much safer and more convenient to take.
"That would be the ultimate goal, to develop the drug as a pill," he said.
Unlike SSRI medications, ketamine does not involve the chemical serotonin as a primary function. By testing ketamine on rats, the researchers were able to examine how the drug worked its way through the brain. What they found was that ketamine helped restore synaptic connections between the neurons, which had been damaged by chronic stress. It does this partly by activating an enzyme called mTOR, setting of a chain reaction.
"Ketamine is able to jumpstart and get these systems revved up again," Duman said.
Copyright © 2010, The Hartford Courant
Posted by Zandy on August 24, 2010, at 18:03:03
In reply to Yale trying to develop Ketamine into oral antidepr, posted by Phillipa on August 24, 2010, at 17:07:49
I think that's facinating, but I would not want to be one of the first to try it after it hits the market. I am so very paranoid of meds after all my bad reactions.
Wonder if the nausea period normally associated with starting SSRIs magically disapears instantly too when you take it!
Posted by Phillipa on August 24, 2010, at 21:07:59
In reply to Re: Yale trying to develop Ketamine into oral antidepr, posted by Zandy on August 24, 2010, at 18:03:03
I'd have to see what happens to others. Only good thing would be if you knew after one dose you could quit if it was horrible instead of waiting weeks for the same. Phillipa
Posted by europerep on August 25, 2010, at 14:56:33
In reply to Re: Yale trying to develop Ketamine into oral antidepr » Zandy, posted by Phillipa on August 24, 2010, at 21:07:59
hehe, well there are already hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people who have taken it, and it looks like they are quite satisfied with it ;).. no, of course I get the point, but if someone gave me the pill they are trying to develop, I wouldn't hesitate a second to try it..
but I guess that, until that pill will be developed, tested, approved and ready for sale I will either have a found a drug that works, or I'll be dead :(...
Posted by SLS on August 25, 2010, at 16:28:59
In reply to Re: Yale trying to develop Ketamine into oral antidepr, posted by europerep on August 25, 2010, at 14:56:33
> hehe, well there are already hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people who have taken it, and it looks like they are quite satisfied with it ;).. no, of course I get the point, but if someone gave me the pill they are trying to develop, I wouldn't hesitate a second to try it..
> but I guess that, until that pill will be developed, tested, approved and ready for sale I will either have a found a drug that works, or I'll be dead :(...If ketamine is found to be globally effective at treating depression, perhaps it will be fast-tracked for approval. I imagine that there will be quite a bit of resistance against that from happening because of its reputation as a street drug. It would be a true injustice if ketamine were withheld from sufferers of treatment resistant depression because of its potential for abuse. Hopefully, scientists will isolate the mechanisms of action of ketamine and come up with more targeted drugs.
- Scott
Posted by europerep on August 27, 2010, at 3:44:02
In reply to Re: Yale trying to develop Ketamine into oral antidepr » europerep, posted by SLS on August 25, 2010, at 16:28:59
I read the article in 'Science' yesterday, and it is very interesting. it makes me wonder why they didn't do this study earlier, it doesn't even seem to be all too difficult to realize, but anyways.
what the article that philippa posted doesn't tell is that they not only used ketamine (a non-selective agent) in their tests in mice, but they also verified whether another substance discovered by roche (Ro25,6981 ; a selective NR2B-antagonist) has the same effects, both neurophysiologically and in depression and anxiety rodent models - and it does! I am not sure whether they know that this molecule does NOT produce the abuseable effects of ketamine, or whether it is only hoped so, but at least this agent is much more specific than ketamine. however, there are some reasons for why I have a hard time believing that this kind of treatment will be developed or approved anytime soon:
if it turned out that these agents treat depression very well - more effective, much shorter time of onset, etc. - this would basically equal a paradigm shift in psychiatry. the question would be whether these agents also work in non-treatment resistant depression, i.e. whether they could become first-line antidepressants. if so, a lot of people, or a lot of companies, would have a vested interest in postponing their release, so that they can get the max out of their patents on "regular" antidepressants. it wouldn't surprise me if companies paid other companies to postpone release of such new drugs until their own patents on 5HT/NE/DA-targeting drugs have expired, etc. that's essentially my main concern.in the meantime, however, anyone who is a scientist can order this Roche molecule on the internet. it's freakin' expensive of course, but if I could buy doses of it, I think I would try it. maybe I'd die, if not, I could present myself at some university for the study of its effects on humans. ;)
Posted by Maxime on August 28, 2010, at 19:59:08
In reply to Yale trying to develop Ketamine into oral antidepr, posted by Phillipa on August 24, 2010, at 17:07:49
I wonder if I will still be alive to try this. It does sound promising.
Posted by Phillipa on August 28, 2010, at 21:05:20
In reply to Re: Yale trying to develop Ketamine into oral antidepr » Phillipa, posted by Maxime on August 28, 2010, at 19:59:08
Maxie I know you you're a fighter. If they do you'll be here to try it. Phillipa
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