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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by wishingstar on December 9, 2007, at 10:07:32
I've been with the same therapist for about a year and 2 months now. Before her, I've had a long list of therapists over many years. Therapy only got serious in the last few years though so there are only three (all in a row, including this current one) I'd say I have really connected myself to or engaged with emotionally.
Here's my problem. I become friends with all of them. No, not the "let's get coffee this weekend" kind of friends, and not the kind where they tell me long, indepth stories about their problems or homelife. I wouldnt call any of them unethical in any way. But we get to a place where we laugh a lot, joke around, and generally keeps things pretty light all the time. I go in and the automatic topic is often my boyfriend, because the story is somewhat dramatic (and surely interesting). He's really very oblivious in some ways but current T and I can see through his behavior pretty easily. We spend a lot of time talking about things related to him.. how dumb xyz was, why he'd do something etc... which may be valid sometimes, but is often more because it's just purely interesting than because it's important to my therapy. Another favorite topic is to talk about my clients at work (I'm a social worker). Rarely are they relevant to my emotional world, it's just interesting. It's interesting for me to talk about as well.. shes the only one I can tell the details without being in trouble ethically. But still, not "therapy". I know the logical answer is "tell her you want to talk about xyz then!" But our relationship has evolved to a point I dont really feel comfortable doing that. I dont say anything to her I wouldnt say to a friend. I'm now pretty conscious of her feelings and "keeping it light".. our relationship just doesnt include deep, dark feelings. It certainly doesnt include things I'd be embarrassed to talk about.. feelings that were selfish, needy, etc. I like her a lot as a person and I know she likes me as well. We'd be friends in any other context. The topic always stays on me but overall, it's just someone fun to talk to. As things have been slipping for me recently, I havent really told her. I know I need to, but it just doesnt "fit". Looking back, I cant believe I ever called her in crisis. I could never do that now, any more than I'd ever call any other random person in my phone book. I'm in a romantic relationship that I know isnt great for me and really should probably end. She knows all about this, but we dont talk about how much it hurts, or how it feels, to be treated the way I'm being treated. We do talk about the arguments we've had, or the ways I've successfully maneuvered to get what I want without him knowing it, etc.. but nothing that matters. If it's not interesting and if we cant laugh about it at some point during the hour, it's off the list. This all works great when I'm not really depressed, but when things get "real", it doesnt work at all.
I know I've had a big role in creating this as well, but now what? My last two therapists before her... the story was different, and the effect was different, but the bottom line was still that I had gotten past their typical boundary lines without them knowing it. One, who I'd been in cotact with through email for years, eventually realized it after offering to be my professional mentor and backed off. But it took years. That relationship was in no way harmful to me, but Id definitely gotten to a point most clients dont get to with her.
I think part of it is that I do work in the profession (I was a counselor and now work for CPS). In a way, we're on the same wavelength. We move in the same professional circles. I'm very good with insight and can tell any of them why something happened the way it did, why I feel something, etc. Emotionally though, I'm on a whole differnet plane. I tell them this, but maybe theyre not able to make sense of the discrepancy. I tend to get along with people very easily in "the real world" and people tend to like me. Making true friends is a whole different thing, but thats beside the point.
I'd love any thoughts on this. As my relationship is getting more hurtful, and my depression seems to be peaking its head, I'm becoming aware that seeing her wont help with any of that. I see a therapist, but Im not in therapy.
Now what? Switch therapists? I guess I could, but given that some variant of this has occured with the last three, I dont have a lot of faith in finding useful therapy. Like I said, I know I have a role in creating this problem, and I'd stop it i I could. But here we are.
Posted by Maria01 on December 9, 2007, at 10:29:57
In reply to boundaries in therapy/'friendship' (LONG), posted by wishingstar on December 9, 2007, at 10:07:32
Please don't be so hard on yourself. If the therapy is beneficial to you, then by all means continue. Therapy need not constitute deep, dark feelings all the time. From what I understand, the "light" stuff goes just as far in creating a good therapeutic foundation as does the more serious stuff.
I would tell her about what is presently going on for you, though...that is really important. If you're nervous about it, preface it with that "I'm really nervous about discussing this, but..." and she sounds like a good enough therapist to take it from there.
Personally, I would not do well in therapy with very tight, rigid boundaries..I work with a T very similiar to yours in style, and aside from a tought spot right now, it's been great. I've also worked in the profession as a practice manager for a relative who was a T, so each T I have worked with has breated a little sigh of relief, as I know to some degreee the nature of the profession and the people in it.
Since you are a social worker, I'm sure your T feels very comfortable with you, since you are professionally related. All that being said, do discuss your present feelings of depressin with her. My t and I have an easygoing relationship, but I remember when I really crashed with depression a couple of months ago. I adressed it withk "I really hate to break up the party but...." and we were able to switch gears smoothly. We are in a tough spot now, but we should be able to get thru it.
From what you've said, you don't have a friendship with your T as much as you have a healthy, secure therapeutic relationship. It's risky in it's own way to play it light, but it's just as necessary as the "darker" concerns are.
It sounds like you have a good enough rapport with her to discuss your feelings about this, but from what I've read, I don't think you have crossed any boundaries at all. The boundaries may be more fluid due to your profession and the therapist's style, but they still haven't been crossed. I think you're the only one who can determine if they have been or not. In either case, I don't think switching T's is the answer. A good T is too hard to find, so hang onto the one you've got! =)
Posted by lovelorn on December 9, 2007, at 10:35:08
In reply to boundaries in therapy/'friendship' (LONG), posted by wishingstar on December 9, 2007, at 10:07:32
>I see a therapist, but Im not in therapy.
You admit you have had a part in moving the relationship away from actually doing therapy. Maybe for next session you can admit to that to her and then tell her honestly that you need to re-focus on actually doing therapy. Mention what is happening (the depression and feeling like you are not doing well) and that you now need to speak about that. Ask her for her help to not let you get distracted away from that. It is "your" time there and you can set the boundaries too. I am sure your T will understand. I am curious as to why you let yourself take the therapy to the other direction.
I am actually in a complete opposite kind of relationship with my therapist. There is no "friendly" back and forth on our every day lives. She doesn't encourage it at all and a part of me lately is thinking it would be a nice break to have it more on a friendly/chatty level after doing so much hard work with my issues. I'm thinking I will speak to my T about that a little when I see her in a few days.
Posted by muffled on December 9, 2007, at 11:05:25
In reply to boundaries in therapy/'friendship' (LONG), posted by wishingstar on December 9, 2007, at 10:07:32
Wishy I am short on time, but wanted to dash off that i myself do not feel in ANY way discarded by you. I do the same, and have come to realize that babblers UNDERSTAND that sometimes we need to be away for a bit.
Its OK!
Also, I have been thru a similiar thing w/my T. We were of a mind I was 'done' and preparing for termination etc, and my T is very kind and we have many things in common, so she did the common T thing of saying we could still keep in touch etc. We were working more in a friendly type direction. BUT, it came to be, that I was NOT done....
And so it has been some what of a challenge to be able to continue to work w/her cuz I worry bout hurting her etc. We have spent an amount of time working thru this. It is hard for me to lean and trust ANYbody. So after much thot I decided to stick with her. And its OK. I COULD go back. We DO work harder at trying to keep the boundaries a little tighter for now. It was very frustrating initially, but I am getting used to it.
Ugh, goto go. LOts more to say, will post again later! LOL!
Suffice it to say, I think it might be a GOOD thing to stick w/T and work thru this...find out why it keeps happening....etc.
Later,
Nice to see ya,
M
Posted by antigua3 on December 9, 2007, at 11:19:55
In reply to boundaries in therapy/'friendship' (LONG), posted by wishingstar on December 9, 2007, at 10:07:32
Sounds like you fall into the same pattern with each therapist, which would really be great if you could explore. Is it a way of distancing yourself? Is it a repeat of other relationships in your life, that it is easier to keep things light because you're afraid she may not like you as much if you expose your true self. did you do this as a child?
I agree with you--switching therapists is not the answer if this is a pattern for you. Try to find out what the pattern means.
best of luck,
antigua
Posted by rskontos on December 9, 2007, at 11:21:27
In reply to boundaries in therapy/'friendship' (LONG), posted by wishingstar on December 9, 2007, at 10:07:32
Wishingstar, my take in this is is a little different. I think, IMHO, that this is maybe your way to keep her at bay. Not to go deep. Initially. And now when things are bad and you need to you are unable. Maybe at first it was ok, you didn't really want to go deeper and she felt it recognized and went along. Not that things have changed you need to open the door.
My T will do this too if I change the subject to say my son or daughter or H. She won't go back to the deeper subject unless I change it. Then bam we go deep. Because in therapy sometimes you need lighter sessions.
But all you seem to be having are lighter sessions. She has in my opinion let it go too long. Maybe she doesn't realized that you deeper issues than you do. You may seem to have it all together or she may think you aren't ready.
So I would either tell face to face or my preferred method email. Do whatever you are comfortable with. Write it down and give it too her. Ihave done that too.
I don't think changing is the solution. too much to retell. Just tell her what you need and hopefully she will surprise you.
Good luck and let us know.
rsk
Posted by seldomseen on December 9, 2007, at 11:35:24
In reply to boundaries in therapy/'friendship' (LONG), posted by wishingstar on December 9, 2007, at 10:07:32
I did the same with my T. For YEARS, we talked about just light and superficial things. As it turns out he was just waiting for me to be ready to talk about the real reason I was in therapy.
I got very frustrated with myself for not opening up and finally shared that with him. He clapped his hands together and "alright, let's get to work".
I think what you are doing is employing a defense mechanism. It's okay. When you are ready you will talk. Like me, it may take years before you get ready. But you will.
In my opinion, all you have to do is keep going to therapy and keep yourself in the game so to speak.
Seldom.
Posted by Daisym on December 9, 2007, at 13:37:39
In reply to Re: boundaries in therapy/'friendship' (LONG) » wishingstar, posted by seldomseen on December 9, 2007, at 11:35:24
I kind of agree with what everyone else said but I have a little bit of a twist -- Maybe you need either a different style of therapy or a really, really smart therapist.
When you know a lot, often you can work circles around someone and they might not even know it. If you see a therapist who has experience working with others in the profession, it is much harder to "hide" your problems. It sounds to me like your therapist is inadvertantly colluding with you to not go deep.
My other thought is that this therapist did see you when you were pretty suicidal and not fuctioning well. She may think you aren't strong enough to rip that apart again - given that you are functioning in your job and in your life.
Bottom line is you won't know if she can help you unless you risk telling her you need help. Wouldn't you want one of your clients to tell you if you were off track?
Good luck with this.
Posted by wishingstar on December 10, 2007, at 6:10:14
In reply to boundaries in therapy/'friendship' (LONG), posted by wishingstar on December 9, 2007, at 10:07:32
I just want to say thank you everyone for the responses. I'm on my way to work in a few minutes (I should be getting ready..) and have an appt with T at 9. My boyfriend and I had a bit of an argument last night and my feelings are pretty hurt so at least I'll have some gist for the mill, right?
I'll respond more later. I know I have a part in this.. it's just figuring out what to do about it. I need to get dressed and get to work.
This is the end of the thread.
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