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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by kid_A on July 17, 2001, at 19:03:08
I hate to compete with someone else's horrible day, I guess I just don't know what to do. But I just don't have anywhere else to turn and I only hope that someone somehwere somehow has some form of empathy, some empathic ability within them, maybe, perchance, god willing, whatever that may mean, to understand what I am saying...What kind of story could I tell, a brief instance of 1 long doomed relationship, sparse and sporadic short and doomed relationships, unrequited love, self loathing, a lifetime of the combination of the two, a lifetime of drinking to get drunk, of drug abuse quelled by my own drive to get beyond abuse, yet still a life time of needing to get beyond my own self, to get as far away from myself mentally as possible; a life time of impossible hopes and dreams; a life time of broken promises and abusers; a life time of emptiness and loneliness even amoungst friends, lonliness in the midst of a crowd... Utter and deplorable self hatred and an inability to climb above my own spires of depression to clouds above... unable to climb the mountainous rocky wastes of black clifs and cravasses that fall to nowhere, climbing up a little and falling back down again to the wastes below... taking one step forward and two steps back...
Week 6 on medication with a primary thrust of that being an interim dosage while i was out of the country... My moods flaten, oblique, they pan out and merge with the horizon, like the horizon at the merger of ocean and sky.... flat blue that sears together and becomes one thing, where up is down and there is no middle... then spikes of depression, black waves of anxiety amoungst the anhedonia and apathy, amoungst the lack of utter feeling... exclamation marks amountst the numbness of my every day life.
And it looks like it may be this way for the rest of my life, that medication wont help, there is always that chance, I'm going to give it my best shot, I really do wan't to live, but when I look at myself, and see myself depressed, I don't want to live a life of depression, of infrequent highs and terifying lows, of switching from medication to medication to find something that works. I truly feel for all of you have gone through so much to find what works, who are still searching... It scares me half to death to think I might not ever be able to control my depression to lead a normal life, that one day I will die young, sad, and ignorant of what I could have been, of what life is like for people who can shake off the blues with an iron will and determined oh yeah, can do spirit....
Calm blue ocean.
Calm blue ocean.
Calm blue ocean.does -anyone- know how I feel?
Posted by geekUK on July 17, 2001, at 19:53:13
In reply to I hate myself and I want to die., posted by kid_A on July 17, 2001, at 19:03:08
Hey,
I am scared of the possibility of this happening. my depakote may be having somewhat of an effect. I have not been happy or angry or anything but low down and trawling for about 7 days. breif snatches of something for a few mins. then settles back down. Just thought of an emilly bronte poem 'if this be all' I think it was her anyway, possibly not good reading now but a good poem It kind of sums up how I feel and maybe you feel similar. But I think that what I am missing is the flow and the power of the wind through the trees, and now its just a cold winters day becalmed. But I realise the wind kept wipping round the forest to its own will, taking me to the same old places, flinging me through the same sharp branches. I did not see the forest I saw the trees. I hope that in time spring will come and the wind will be my master, I will choose where to go and see places in the forest I have never seen before, places of beuty. I will walk amongs the bluebells, and feel the moss between my feet. to feel real.
Sorry got lost in that one for a while, I dont know If I helped, I hope you follow (dont have time for a proofing)
PS I lied, I mean by spring that once the rollercoaster is over I might be able to start to feel things as others do. To hit the reset button as it were.
> I hate to compete with someone else's horrible day, I guess I just don't know what to do. But I just don't have anywhere else to turn and I only hope that someone somehwere somehow has some form of empathy, some empathic ability within them, maybe, perchance, god willing, whatever that may mean, to understand what I am saying...
>
> What kind of story could I tell, a brief instance of 1 long doomed relationship, sparse and sporadic short and doomed relationships, unrequited love, self loathing, a lifetime of the combination of the two, a lifetime of drinking to get drunk, of drug abuse quelled by my own drive to get beyond abuse, yet still a life time of needing to get beyond my own self, to get as far away from myself mentally as possible; a life time of impossible hopes and dreams; a life time of broken promises and abusers; a life time of emptiness and loneliness even amoungst friends, lonliness in the midst of a crowd... Utter and deplorable self hatred and an inability to climb above my own spires of depression to clouds above... unable to climb the mountainous rocky wastes of black clifs and cravasses that fall to nowhere, climbing up a little and falling back down again to the wastes below... taking one step forward and two steps back...
>
> Week 6 on medication with a primary thrust of that being an interim dosage while i was out of the country... My moods flaten, oblique, they pan out and merge with the horizon, like the horizon at the merger of ocean and sky.... flat blue that sears together and becomes one thing, where up is down and there is no middle... then spikes of depression, black waves of anxiety amoungst the anhedonia and apathy, amoungst the lack of utter feeling... exclamation marks amountst the numbness of my every day life.
>
> And it looks like it may be this way for the rest of my life, that medication wont help, there is always that chance, I'm going to give it my best shot, I really do wan't to live, but when I look at myself, and see myself depressed, I don't want to live a life of depression, of infrequent highs and terifying lows, of switching from medication to medication to find something that works. I truly feel for all of you have gone through so much to find what works, who are still searching... It scares me half to death to think I might not ever be able to control my depression to lead a normal life, that one day I will die young, sad, and ignorant of what I could have been, of what life is like for people who can shake off the blues with an iron will and determined oh yeah, can do spirit....
>
> Calm blue ocean.
> Calm blue ocean.
> Calm blue ocean.
>
> does -anyone- know how I feel?
Posted by mila on July 17, 2001, at 21:59:25
In reply to I hate myself and I want to die., posted by kid_A on July 17, 2001, at 19:03:08
Hi,
I understand how you feel, kid. Thank you for telling your story...
One thing that helped me most while I was going through the medication ordeal was the understanding that my disorders were not "like diabetes", a metaphor frequently used here on the board. Mood and anxiety disorders are actually treatable, and the chance of full recovery is there. Both depression and treatment from it are not pleasant, or at least were not so for me. I had been on medication for 7 months and, except a short romance with Paxil, it was hell. But I got cured. So can/will you.
The important thing to realize is that your condition might be as well situationally determined, which means that life circumstances screwed your chances for happiness. It is not your fault. Absolutely not. And now it is time to repair your hardware and go for it again. Never give up on your dreams, pursue you dearest desires. You'll come to know a great love. It's inevitable. It is worth living.
Treatment might be unpleasant, and it was for me. But those meds do work silently on the background and repair something in our brains. Once you get well, you'd have to go through the recovery from the consequences of the treatment, and fine tune yourself to the world again, but that's not that bad. The last and weirdest stage of recovery is when you realize how traumatic was the whole experience of having gone through the mental illness. I am sometimes shaking my head and say "I can't believe I went through this and survived, and recovered", this is unbelievable.
Please, remember, that the medication is not only about the symptoms. It is about something else in your body, in your brain too. The symptoms might worsen, but the brain might be getting healed meanwhile. It's sometimes just like chemotherapy, I believe. But the reward is big. Worth it.
you are here not to suffer, but to love and be loved. Please, stay, let it come to you.
mila
Posted by Shar on July 17, 2001, at 22:43:13
In reply to Re: I hate myself and I want to die., posted by mila on July 17, 2001, at 21:59:25
Oh kid, been there, been there, been there...oh, did I say I've been there? Since about early teen years depression with lots of good old suicidal ideation. I understand what you are going through, and you have my sympathy.
Even before my depression set in, I wanted to die. Think there must have been some family dynamic there...d'oh!
One thing I learned over the years was that I needed to make some decisions about suicide. I'm 49 now (older than I thought I would ever be) and one big decision was not to kill myself.
I think you have a good chance of moving beyond your current anguish and pain. You are entering treatment when tons more is known about treating depression and treatment-resistant depression, new meds, and all the time-tested older meds. A lot of people here do research on what's out there, and work with their pdocs, and learn about what meds may help or not, what side effects might be, what time frame might you expect for the med to begin working, etc.
I never thought I would get beyond basic depression as my normal mood (black mood). However, much to my surprise, my current med cocktail has really helped a great deal. I would say I'm mostly blue now.
Some moments are pert near clear.
I waited decades to try meds. Tried all sorts of talk therapy instead. Still do talk therapy. With meds, really the worst that can happen is that I would end up depressed--where I'd already been. After trying several meds and combos, slowly there was one that helped, then that was augmented, it was better, then that was augmented.
I believe you really can have hope. It takes perseverence, but not as much perseverence as staying alive with depression and suicidal ideas. To me, the med side effects were crappy when I had them, but not as crappy as the depression.
Good luck. Hang on. Keep writing.
Shar
Posted by sar on July 18, 2001, at 0:35:47
In reply to Yeppers, posted by Shar on July 17, 2001, at 22:43:13
just had to agree w/ Shar. good advice that she gave; i cannot add anymore. read her message again.
Posted by dreamer on July 18, 2001, at 1:22:08
In reply to I hate myself and I want to die., posted by kid_A on July 17, 2001, at 19:03:08
>
Hey Kid
Would you prefer to be someone else??
Think about it.
Your special, you come across as being talented/creative, aware on a higher level, a good person. Try to squeeze some hope out of this life no matter how different you feel against the other sheep.
Hating yourself is better than indifference it CAN switch to love.
Posted by Anna Laura on July 18, 2001, at 1:42:41
In reply to I hate myself and I want to die., posted by kid_A on July 17, 2001, at 19:03:08
>
> Calm blue ocean.
> Calm blue ocean.
> Calm blue ocean.
>
> does -anyone- know how I feel?Hi Kid,
I understand what you're talking about. I'm actually in the middle of a life crisis, don't know were to turn, when i got sick i was twenty-one: depression was way easier to handle, still had a lot of options, there were still traces of my old-self and my ideals were there to keep me going. Somehow blue skies in the foreground.
Im' 32 right now: i'm supposed to be at the peak of life, reaching my goals, etc... I 'm a college drop-out, doing small jobs and still depressed instead. I went through pure madness when i was 24, thought i'd never recover from that, but i did; don't know how i managed to survive psychotic depression: it was like burning alive: i envied those at the stakes way back in the middle age because they burned let's say for half an hour and then they would eventually died.
But the worst was yet to come; I could still feel love and my political ideals were still there (they were so strong that soothed my wound somehow). Well, i recovered from that, thought i was going to get well soon, but to my surprise, as depression symptoms subsided i grew more and more anhedonic, till the day i realized i lost my "self" on the way back from major depression. When or how i cannot tell, but i disappeared; the flamboyant, talented, passionate activist has been replaced by a dim, flattened, conformist self. Sometimes i regret i survived: anhedonia managed to do what madness didn't do: it earesed me, day by day, month by month.
It's like building castles in the sand and anhedonia being the wave desrupting the fragile little castle made of sand which is me.
Lately i have been growing stronger (the final outcome of a determined day-by-day dediction to myself, continuos self interrogation, insight producing and socializing a little bit more).
Still, i mourn over the loss of my youth, the dead of what i used to call me: yes, i was proud of myself, didn't want to be anybody else, now i sometimes envy animals, old people, even people with cancer, because i think they 've got something to hold on. They still have themselves.
I thought the self i used to call "me" could last forever, till my last breath: i used to think that i could keep my ideals until the end, but it wasn't so; sometimes i'm puzzled, can't believe it's true, but it has happened and it happened to me. My "love" has died. Now i feel emptied out, just meangless soul digging, soul devouring. The world around me it's so unfamiliar, like a high definition movie: cruelsome, cold metallic light bathing everything around me: no more technicolor like sights.
I walk aimlessly on clean hospital like streets, holding the regret of horror in my pocket.
I try desperately to listen to the slightest sensation, and when it comes i softly unfold it, because i'm afraid it would vanish. I pray for the sweet sea breeze and my body as a whole to come back again. The past was so colourful, and my memories so loud compared to the present that i sometimes feel like i 'm dreaming. Can't remember things, (i.e. what i did yesterday) probably because they are unimportant to me.
But i keep on going somehow: i still hope i can feel emotions and sensations again, still think that i can grow more lively somehow. I still hope that they come back to me kissing me softly before plunging in to the vast ocean we call death.
The last Sunday was horrible: i wanted to die, then i decided to fight back. I still feel sick at times i was stable till the last month, now the beast awakened again, i'm currently having like micro-bouts of depression at the moment; i don't know if i'm stepping backwards again or if i'll manage to bring this monster down: sometimes i feel i have got the power to tame it, other times it's just out of control and i feel defeated, i go back to bed then, my private shelter, and no matter what hour of the day is i sleep and i sleep till the day it's over and i can restart all over again.
I think i decided to live: i'm managing to figure myself like a warrior: wether is a warrior made of sand i don't know, let's see what happen next.Hold on, you never know what could happen in the future: death can wait.
Anna Laura
Posted by Roo on July 18, 2001, at 8:29:01
In reply to Re: I hate myself and I want to die., posted by Anna Laura on July 18, 2001, at 1:42:41
Kid,
Yes, I've felt that way. It's awful, desperate. The
shear frustration of it can make me turn on myself. Like
an animal caught in a trap that chews it's own arm
off. Ugh. But on the more positive side, everyone is
right, you never know what can happen. Great things
can happen that you never expected or could have thought
of yourself. When I tell myself "it's always going
to be like this" sometimes, when I have the strength
that is, I also remind myself "You don't know what
can or can't happen".
I'm sorry you are feeling so awful. You seem like a
really good person. I always enjoy your posts.Ps. AnnaLaura, if you're reading--you have a beautiful
way with words...do you write poetry?
>
Posted by Kingfish on July 18, 2001, at 9:04:22
In reply to Re: I hate myself and I want to die., posted by Roo on July 18, 2001, at 8:29:01
> ---
Posted by Anna Laura on July 18, 2001, at 11:41:38
In reply to Re: I hate myself and I want to die., posted by Roo on July 18, 2001, at 8:29:01
>
> Ps. AnnaLaura, if you're reading--you have a beautiful
> way with words...do you write poetry?
> >
Yes i do, but most of them are written in italian: i'm afraid many of them would sound odd if they were translated in to English.Thanks anyway!
Anna Laura
Posted by kid_A on July 18, 2001, at 19:48:38
In reply to I hate myself and I want to die., posted by kid_A on July 17, 2001, at 19:03:08
thankyou everyone who took the time to respond, it was i guess one of my 'bad days', and i really do appreciate the understanding words... a lot of good advice, well absorbed...special prize goes to geekUK for getting the subject reference... :).... all the way from the muddy banks of the wishkah...
i also write... maybe we should start a poetry thread... any other writers out there?
(you 2 Anna Laura, i dont care if it -is- in italian, italian is beautiful just to read)
hugs drugs and kisses
Posted by Wendy B. on July 19, 2001, at 1:21:49
In reply to I dye myself and I want to hate...thankyouall..., posted by kid_A on July 18, 2001, at 19:48:38
> i also write... maybe we should start a poetry thread... any other writers out there?
I just assumed we were all 'writers' of some sort, we write here almost every day, some of us... Several posters on the PsySocial board have such eloquent ways of expressing themselves, Anna Laura being one of them...I am working on a short story right now...
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 19, 2001, at 12:34:24
In reply to Re:FOR ROO, posted by Anna Laura on July 18, 2001, at 11:41:38
> Yes i do, but most of them are written in italian: i'm afraid many of them would sound odd if they were translated in to English.
>
> Thanks anyway!I noticed the other day that the translation buttons are "working" again:
Sì, ma la maggior parte di loro sono scritte in italiano: sono impaurito che molte di loro suonerebbero dispari se fossero tradotte dentro all'inglese.
Ringraziamenti comunque!
Bob
Posted by Anna Laura on July 20, 2001, at 1:48:51
In reply to Re: sounding odd if translated, posted by Dr. Bob on July 19, 2001, at 12:34:24
> > Yes i do, but most of them are written in italian: i'm afraid many of them would sound odd if they were translated in to English.
> >
> > Thanks anyway!
>
> I noticed the other day that the translation buttons are "working" again:
>
> Sì, ma la maggior parte di loro sono scritte in italiano: sono impaurito che molte di loro suonerebbero dispari se fossero tradotte dentro all'inglese.
>
> Ringraziamenti comunque!
>
> BobDr. Bob,
Thanks so much for your concern, please don't get offended, but
i'm afraid i don't need that : the translation in to italian sounds too weird; i prefer to do that by myself.Thanks again
Anna Laura
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 20, 2001, at 7:53:51
In reply to Re: sounding odd if translated Dr. Bob, posted by Anna Laura on July 20, 2001, at 1:48:51
> > > Yes i do, but most of them are written in italian: i'm afraid many of them would sound odd if they were translated in to English.
> > >
> > > Thanks anyway!
> >
> > I noticed the other day that the translation buttons are "working" again:
> >
> > Sì, ma la maggior parte di loro sono scritte in italiano: sono impaurito che molte di loro suonerebbero dispari se fossero tradotte dentro all'inglese.
> >
> > Ringraziamenti comunque!> Thanks so much for your concern, please don't get offended, but
> i'm afraid i don't need that : the translation in to italian sounds too weird; i prefer to do that by myself.I'm not offended, it sounds even weirder if translated back into English. In fact, this has been a game in the past. :-)
Bob
Posted by kid_A on July 20, 2001, at 12:23:06
In reply to Re: sounding odd if translated, posted by Dr. Bob on July 20, 2001, at 7:53:51
> I'm not offended, it sounds even weirder if translated back into English. In fact, this has been a game in the past. :-)
Well *I'm* offended... Uh, just kidding....! :)
no wait, thats offensive.....
UNA MANCIATA DI SASSI
Dondolano le scarpe sdrucite
dell’uomo seduto sul bordo del fiume.
Immoto è lo sguardo sul cerchio
del sasso lanciato, che allarga
per poi svanire nel nulla.
Un altro sasso, un altro cerchio
e in esso il film del tempo perduto.
Una pausa, un tonfo, un cerchio
ancora più grande, e sull’argine
una manciata di sassi la cui ombra
è sfruttata da due mosche in amore.
-1976 Francesco Belluomini
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 21, 2001, at 14:00:21
In reply to Re: sounding odd if translated, posted by kid_A on July 20, 2001, at 12:23:06
> UNA MANCIATA DI SASSI
>
> Dondolano le scarpe sdrucite
> dell’uomo seduto sul bordo del fiume.
> Immoto è lo sguardo sul cerchio
> del sasso lanciato, che allarga
> per poi svanire nel nulla.
> Un altro sasso, un altro cerchio
> e in esso il film del tempo perduto.
> Una pausa, un tonfo, un cerchio
> ancora più grande, e sull’argine
> una manciata di sassi la cui ombra
> è sfruttata da due mosche in amore.
> -1976 Francesco BelluominiOne thing about translation, you need to set the "language" indicator (right after the "subject") or else the right translation options won't be offered...
Bob
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