![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 21 of 21. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Krysti on November 8, 2002, at 14:04:32
Hey again,
By the way, did you get my e-mails I sent to you? I had sent some links to information about Depakote and Clonazepam. The info about Depakote said the recommended starting dose is 750mg. I can't remember if I was taking 500mg or 1000mg. I was manic when I first started taking it and it took me a month to fully come down. Each day I could feel myself coming down a little more. I never increaded the dose and I was only on it for a couple of months. I never felt drugged or anything, just started feeling really blah, like I had no personality whatsoever anymore. That's when I switched to the Gabitril. I felt the same way on that and then I got depressed, then started having crying spells. That's when I decided to add the Lexapro.
How are you feeling now? When they do the blood tests, they can test it to see if you're within the therapeutic range. I would ask your doctor about that. Although, I was in the therapeutic range when I was still manic and when I felt blah. Everyone's experience is different though. It may just take you a while to get used to it. If you are feeling that out of it though, you might want to wait before you increase the dose again. I'd ask your doctor about it if you keep feeling like that. Could it maybe be from taking more Clonazepam than usual?
I'd better go, I have a lot of work to get done before 5:00 today. I hope you're feeling better. I will let you know how Seinfeld is : )
Krysti
Posted by Mr Cushing on November 8, 2002, at 14:34:31
In reply to Mr Cushing, posted by Krysti on November 8, 2002, at 14:04:32
I was just talking to my MD today and he told me that the highest he would recommend a patient to go on Valproic Acid (Depakote) is 500mg per day. He said that there are still some Doctors that insist on it being 1,000, and some scary ones that insist on even prescribing more than that. He said that from his years of experience with the drug, his research on it, the conferences he's attended, etc. that it's a really tricky one to get right. He said that if you're Bi-Polar and you're taking it, but you're taking too little of it, it could increase the effects of your manic or depressive episodes, whichever you're going through at the time. Then if you take too much of it, you can push yourself to the opposite end of the spectrum fairly easily. For example, when you were manic and you started taking that high of a dosage, that "blah" feeling, you shouldn't have experienced. That would have been the cue to reduce the amount you were taking.Ummmm, he told me that alcohol really shouldn't be used with the drug, but that if you do drink, just be very cautious. Don't drink till you start to feel really out of it because it could counterbalance the effects of the medication.
Then I asked him about smoking weed on the drug. Honestly, I don't plan on quitting smoking anytime soon. Been smoking for 13 years and I rather enjoy it. Anyways, he said that if smoking weed didn't make you manic before you got on the medication, then it really shouldn't have any effect on it now that you're on the medication. That as a warning, just when you're smoking if you feel like you immediately need to take a nap, or if you become so stoned from a small dose that you're VERY giddy and pretty disoriented, quit it untill your body stabilizes a little bit more with the medication before starting again.
He said that out of the two evils (alcohol and marijuana), he would highly suggest smoking instead of drinking. That's alright with me though since that's what I planned to do in the first place.
He also gave me a standing order to get my blood work done. He said that it would probably be best for me to increase it yet again when I'm ready to 375mg per day and let that rest in me for about 3-4 weeks, if it's still not enough, talk to both my Psychiatrist and himself before increasing it any further. He said that in very rare cases is 500mg needed to control a Bi-Polar's mood swings, and sometimes if it is, and the person isn't so unbalanced that he needs to be hospitalized, that maybe a switch to a different drug is a better decision.
It took me a little bit today before I started feeling alright, but honestly, right now I feel great. The Doctor asked me in his office today if I felt like I was Manic now with the increase in the medication made yesterday and I told him that I don't feel like anxiety-ridden, but I do feel pretty happy and have a nice amount of energy. *shrugs* How the Hell is a normal person supposed to feel anyways? What's normal? What's "balanced"???
I do find though that once it gets about 10 hours or so between my doses (I noticed this yesterday too) that I start to get really tired and my body kind of aches a little bit. Also, I'm having kind of the opposite effect that most people have on this drug. I keep reading that people have HUGE appetites on Depakote. Honestly, I really haven't had much of an appetite lately. I'll eat like a small lunch with a bottle of Sobe and then have an average sized supper later on in the day.
I could be feeling more drugged out in the mornings because of the amount of Clonazepam that I take, however, I'm still not completely confident in the Depakote ever being able to help me sleep properly. I've had a VERY hard time sleeping for as long as I can remember. When I became completely manic for about a year or so there, the insomnia became almost unbearable. But ever since I was born I've had trouble sleeping. I don't want to risk taking something like Ambien or anything like that because I'll probably be needing to take it like every night and for years on end. The Clonazepam, when I take a high enough dose of it (only .75mg so far, so that's not too bad) gets rid of the racing thoughts in my head and I'm able to drift off comfortably to sleep.
Oh, and I got that book that you suggested for me to read yesterday, "The Unquiet Mind". It's on order now from Amazon.com with some other books that I plan on reading this month.
Anyways, let me know how that Seinfeld show is tonight and I guess I'll talk to you tommorrow.
Posted by Mr Cushing on November 8, 2002, at 14:35:58
In reply to Mr Cushing, posted by Krysti on November 8, 2002, at 14:04:32
I forgot... No, I didn't get any of the emails from you. Are you sure you sent them to my address?
Posted by BeardedLady on November 8, 2002, at 16:24:13
In reply to Mr Cushing, posted by Krysti on November 8, 2002, at 14:04:32
Hey, guys! Please take your drug discussion to Psycho-Babble, not Psycho-Social-Babble!
Thanks.
beardy
Posted by Krysti on November 8, 2002, at 16:56:02
In reply to Mr Cushing » Krysti, posted by BeardedLady on November 8, 2002, at 16:24:13
> Hey, guys! Please take your drug discussion to Psycho-Babble, not Psycho-Social-Babble!
>
> Thanks.
>
> beardyBeardy,
Is there a board to talk socially AND about drugs? That is actually why we came to this board, because our talking was starting to get more on the social side. But, now I guess we're talking about drugs again. Sorry!
Krysti
Posted by Mr Cushing on November 8, 2002, at 17:07:07
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing, posted by Krysti on November 8, 2002, at 16:56:02
*shrugs* So what do you want to do? Try to go back to the Medicine board?
Posted by Krysti on November 8, 2002, at 17:22:50
In reply to Mr Cushing » Krysti, posted by BeardedLady on November 8, 2002, at 16:24:13
Is there a board to talk socially AND about drugs? That is actually why we came to this board, because our talking was starting to get more on the social side. But, now I guess we're talking about drugs again. Sorry!
Krysti
Posted by Krysti on November 8, 2002, at 17:23:54
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing » Krysti, posted by Mr Cushing on November 8, 2002, at 17:07:07
Hey Cush,
I just sent an e-mail to your e-mail address. Let me know on here if you get it.
Krysti
Posted by Dinah on November 8, 2002, at 17:26:43
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing » Krysti, posted by Mr Cushing on November 8, 2002, at 17:07:07
Hey, don't let it worry you. We're happy to have you here, or on the meds board.
As long as you talk about meds in your post you probably won't get redirected to Psycho-Social Babble. And on Psycho-Social Babble, we frequently refer to our life with medications, since that is a part of our lives.
Please stick around and join us here. It's been pretty slow on the Social Board lately, but we have a lot of fun sometimes.
And if you have medication questions or comments, you can post them on Psycho-Babble.
I think it's terrific that you're trying to navigate the various boards here. I saw where you decided on Psycho-Babble that your conversation had veered away from meds so you decided to come here. It's a fine line sometimes.
Welcome to Psycho-Social Babble.
Dinah
Posted by Mr Cushing on November 8, 2002, at 18:22:13
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing, posted by Krysti on November 8, 2002, at 17:23:54
:-( No, I didn't get your email. I can't figure out what you're doing wrong... I know I posted my email address properly and it's not that hard to get right lol...Anyways, we've been invited to stay here on this board, or you can give me your email address and we can see where you're going wrong with this. I was a Help Desk Operator for a VERY brief point in my life but I definitely know enough about computers now to figure out where you're going wrong.
Let me know what you think about what my MD said concerning the Depakote. He told me that he VERY rarely pushes patients up to 500mg on the drug and unless they're absolutely manic, if that much is needed he'd rather see them on a different drug. *shrugs* I don't think I've ever been actually "normal" or on an "even keel" for the majority of my life, so exactly how should I know when I'm on the right dose for me? What would you say some of the signs are?
Oh, and let me know how that Seinfeld show went. You're very lucky, I wish I could go.
Posted by BeardedLady on November 9, 2002, at 7:43:16
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing - BeardedLady, posted by Krysti on November 8, 2002, at 17:22:50
We're having a drug discussion in the thread above, as a matter of fact.
beardy
Posted by krysti on November 9, 2002, at 11:11:29
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing Krysti, posted by Dinah on November 8, 2002, at 17:26:43
Hi Dinah,
Thanks for the message. I was starting to think my posts were going to look like this:
Psycho-babble Social Board:
Hi Mike,
How are you doing? What are you doing tonight? Please now go to Pyscho-babble Books Board.
Psycho-babble Book Board:
Hi Mike,
Have you read "An Unqiet Mind" yet? - oops "An Unquiet Mind". What did you think of it? Please now go to the Psycho-babble Medication Issue Board.
Psycho-babble Medication Issue Board:
Hi Mike,
How are your medications working for you? Please go the the Psycho-babble Religion Board.
Psycho-babble Religion Board:
Hey Mike,
Do you believe in God?
LOL - That could get really old!
Krysti : )
Posted by Mr Cushing on November 9, 2002, at 11:29:47
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing, posted by Krysti on November 8, 2002, at 17:23:54
Hey, how was Seinfeld last night?I learned a pretty important lesson last night, I should definitely not drink yet with my medication. I had like 3 drinks and smoked a few joints with one of my buddies last night. Just hanging out at his place listening to some music and talking. After about 3 drinks, I was explaining to him how if Scientists could figure out the way to Clone Sheep, why haven't they come up with a way for humans to grow wings. Would it not be cool to fly? And just went off on that for about 30 minutes till my buddy is like, K Mike, you need to relax, I'm taking you home. My mind was just completely thrown through a loop.
Anyways, that presentation that that Doctor has up on the meds board about Bi-Polar illness was really interesting. I just finished listening to that actually.
K, I'll talk to you later on today. I should be around here most of the day.
Posted by krysti on November 9, 2002, at 11:49:27
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing » Krysti, posted by Mr Cushing on November 8, 2002, at 18:22:13
Hey there,
Seinfeld show was good : ) Better than I expected actually. It was pretty neat to get to see him live and we had really good seats. Some people were taking pics, I wish I had brought my camera! Oh well.
Okay, you're going to laugh at this one - my job is computer support! That is what I do for a living is help other computer-challenged people among other things : ) Besides, most of the e-mails I sent you, I just replied to you so it's not like I could have typed your address wrong - weird. My e-mail address is KrystiT71@aol.com. Try to send me a message again and I will try to reply to you again.
About the Depakote, I totally agree. When I first went on it I was totally manic and then when I came down, I was still on the same dose which is weird. I was definitely taking too high of a dose at that point in my opinion. I'd still like to know though why they would choose to go with that one first when it's such a pain with the blood tests and all. I could see maybe for people who are in a total manic state, if that one works best to bring you down, but otherwise? Actually, come to think of it, the reason why my first pdoc put me on that also was because I had started drinking pretty much daily - when I was up, I was trying to come down, when I was down - I was trying to come up. And above all else, I was drinking to try to shut off my mind! Depakote is supposed to help take away a craving for alcohol which it did for me when I first started taking it. I guess they also prescribe it sometimes for alcoholics when they're drying them out. I think if you start feeling blah, like you have no personality at all, you know you're taking too much. At least that's how it was for me. Imagine feeling blah after so much anxiety for so long, at first it was a relief, but it got old real quick. I definitely don't want to go through life with no personality!
I totally understand what you mean about, what is "normal"??? When I feel it again, I'll have to let you know how I feel. I think I'm getting too up again on the Lexapro - definitely not manic, but starting to think too much again. And I can tell, I'm starting to fight sleep again. Do you ever feel like that? Like you know you need to go to bed, but you don't want to. I did it last night and was up till 3:00 am. It's like I'm tired, but I'm not. I want to go to sleep, but I don't. I'm starting to take the Ambien every night again, not a good sign. I think I'm going to up the Gabitril some and see if that helps. Scared I'm going to get too low again though so I still haven't done it yet. I've got to though. Trial and error is what it's all about until that right combo is found. Frustrating, huh?
I have had days where I've felt normal though, when you feel it, you'll know. I just still need to find the right combo that keeps me there.
I'm thinking maybe we should start posting again on the med board, what do you think? Even though we're talking about other things, I think the meds will probably always be a part of the conversation.
How are you feeling today?
Krysti
Posted by krysti on November 9, 2002, at 12:04:01
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing, posted by Mr Cushing on November 9, 2002, at 11:29:47
Ugh! Reminds me of a conversation I had with one of my friends when I was manic on how people would taste if you ate them and which parts would taste best! Not that I wanted to try it, lol.
Yeah, drinking is a bad thing on meds. It doesn't give them the proper chance to work right. I should take my own advice though : ) It's hard to give up something that you enjoy and has been a part of your life for so long. I don't drink like I used to, but it's hard to give it up socially. I like hanging out with people and having a few drinks or going out to dinner and having a drink, going boating and having a few, bowling, talking, everything just seems to associate with a drink! I guess I've been it doing it for so long, it seems weird not to.
Posted by krysti on November 9, 2002, at 12:17:32
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing - Mr Cushing, posted by krysti on November 9, 2002, at 12:04:01
I replied to your e-mail, did you get it?
Posted by Mr Cushing on November 9, 2002, at 12:19:08
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing - Mr Cushing, posted by krysti on November 9, 2002, at 12:04:01
Yep, I have to agree with that, completely cutting alcohol out of your life takes away a lot of the fun... But then again, if I'm going to get the urge to start eating people lol... maybe it's best if I cut it out.I kind of figured that since I've been drinking and smoking weed now for like 13 years on the regular, it would be best to give up one of them completely while on this medication (meaning pretty much for the rest of my life). *shrugs* Through trial and error, marijuana doesn't seem to affect my moods whatsoever. In fact, I was able to watch that Bi-Polar presentation and fully understand it after smoking a joint this morning. Alcohol, on the other hand, makes me cuckoo for coco-puffs... Think that's got to go.
So you're working sort of in the Help Desk business, huh? God, I really hated that, especially since that was when I was beginning my manic episode. That really didn't last too long, decided to go back to school over it too since I really could NOT picture myself doing that long-term. In fact, I still don't like the sound of a ringing phone. If I'm here alone, the phone has about a .000001% chance of being answered if it rings. I think that's why almost all the phones here have that screening display now too lol...
It's weird how life works though, because the day that I decided to quit working for Compaq (sp?), I went by the College that I had JUST graduated from like a few months prior, met a few friends that I hadn't seen in a while, got into a conversation with them and found out what I actually wanted to do pretty much immediately. I was back in school full-time the following day.
Anyways, I sent you an email, let me know if you get that one.
Posted by Mr Cushing on November 9, 2002, at 12:26:29
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing - Mr Cushing, posted by krysti on November 9, 2002, at 11:49:27
My bad... I figured out immediately what the problem was... Since Hotmail is notorious for junk mail being received, I have like a ton of addresses and stuff on block. Aol.com was one of those. So I removed it from the blocked list, problem should be solved.
Posted by krysti on November 9, 2002, at 12:37:46
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing - Mr Cushing, posted by Mr Cushing on November 9, 2002, at 12:19:08
I actually like my job, although getting bored of it lately which is typical of me. Usually happens a lot sooner with me though, I've been at this company for 3 1/2 years. I work for a company of about 100 people and I do everything computer and telephone related there. I'm a one person I.T. department. Anything that is over my head though, I call up the I.T. department at my parent company for help. I also develop Access databases. I really used to LOVE my job, but like everything else, once I've been doing something for a while I tend to lose interest. That's happening to me now and I hate it. The company I work for is really great and I couldn't ask for better bosses (and believe me, I've had some of the worst).
I've only smoked pot a few times when I was younger. The first time, I had a blast and couldn't stop laughing. The other times, I got paranoid. I was glad though, my dad smoked pot pretty much daily (not in front of me, but when I got older I found out he did). He also drank daily. He was a happy drunk though :) But, after seeing how his motivation in life and the way he lived change, I didn't want to do that so I was glad I didn't like smoking pot. I was also paranoid that I'd get addicted to it. Although, ask me why I drink then, lol :) I guess because it didn't seem as bad because it's legal - what a crock!
Posted by wendy b. on November 9, 2002, at 13:36:59
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing - Mr Cushing, posted by krysti on November 9, 2002, at 11:49:27
> ... getting too up again on the Lexapro - definitely not manic, but starting to think too much again. And I can tell, I'm starting to fight sleep again. Do you ever feel like that? Like you know you need to go to bed, but you don't want to. I did it last night and was up till 3:00 am. It's like I'm tired, but I'm not. I want to go to sleep, but I don't. I'm starting to take the Ambien every night again, not a good sign.
Funny, it's striking how well you describe your nightime habits - mine are very much like this. I think it's some kind of 'oppositional-defiant' thing for me, too -- the more 'sensible' something is to do, the less interest I have in participating in it.When I tell other people how I stay up like this, they look at me funny. Nice to know somebody out there in the world gets it. If I go without too much sleep several nights in a row, however, it can trigger hypomania...
thanks, Krysti,
Wendy
Posted by Krysti on November 13, 2002, at 18:16:25
In reply to Re: Mr Cushing Krysti » krysti, posted by wendy b. on November 9, 2002, at 13:36:59
Hi Wendy,
Thanks for the post. It's good to know I'm not the only screwy one when it comes to sleep : ) That's my sign that something isn't right. I went off the Lexapro and changed my mood stabilizer. Today - so far, so good. We will see though!
Krysti
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Social | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.