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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 34. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by mtdewcmu on April 13, 2011, at 18:34:32
Sheesh. I started posting on a different psychiatry board (which I will not name), and I was giving my mixture of knowledge and opinions in answer to people's questions, and I got scolded like a child by the admins for giving bad medical advice. I got a really rude email from one of them. I have to copy it here, because you have to see this to believe it:
>This is the second time I've had to contact you today over the content of your posts.
>
>Telling members to act without consulting their psychiatrists is just not okay. I don't care who you are or what you do in real life. You obviously don't know enough about psychiatry to begin giving medical advice as evidenced by saying Lamictal and lithium are "redundant."
>
>Further problems with your posts will result in suspension and/or banning.I did not ignore the first email, I just didn't check my email in that time interval (which was like 2 hours). Isn't this board like a big bull session where we're all psych patients and we can speculate and opine to our heart's content? I think it's in the agreement on Dr. Bob's that you should not treat what people say here as if it's coming from an actual doctor.
I can't post on a board where some creepy person is looking over my shoulder and creating a dossier on everything I post, and gets all in a lather about some opinion that I stated without being delicate in case someone took it too literally. I can only imagine what they would say to the people on Dr. Bob's who are anti-psychiatry and tell people to stop their meds every chance they get.
How can you be so judgmental when you are running a board for people who admittedly have mental health issues? If you cater to the depressed and personality disordered, etc, occasionally someone is going to say something that is possibly unhelpful. Are you then going to shame that person and try to make them feel like crap for it? If they didn't already feel like crap, they would not need to be there. How do you get off trying to make someone feel worse for posting an opinion on your mental health board? Anyway, I think their board is junk now that I know that it is censored as if by the Chinese government. I won't name this website, but if you hang around there long enough, you will probably be able to figure out that it's garbage and learn to stay away.
Posted by sigismund on April 13, 2011, at 20:18:20
In reply to Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by mtdewcmu on April 13, 2011, at 18:34:32
I'm not a psychiatrist and you should check with your psychiatrist to see if you are allowed to listen to me.
But lithium and lamictal feel redundant to me.
Posted by mtdewcmu on April 13, 2011, at 20:58:40
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards » mtdewcmu, posted by sigismund on April 13, 2011, at 20:18:20
> I'm not a psychiatrist and you should check with your psychiatrist to see if you are allowed to listen to me.
>
> But lithium and lamictal feel redundant to me.Thank you. The girl that asked the question believed she was on too many meds. So I was trying to help her figure out which ones she might be able to quit. She had unipolar depression, so it wasn't like some refractory bipolar that needed multiple mood stabilizers.
Posted by mtdewcmu on April 13, 2011, at 21:15:35
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards » mtdewcmu, posted by sigismund on April 13, 2011, at 20:18:20
I know I'm preaching to the choir here, but I only said that Lamictal and lithium were "possibly redundant." I didn't say they "were redundant." And on top of that, I reassured her that four meds was not necessarily too many as long as each one was serving a purpose.
Posted by sleepygirl2 on April 13, 2011, at 21:26:35
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards » sigismund, posted by mtdewcmu on April 13, 2011, at 21:15:35
either way, if they've got an "open" forum to discuss things psychological/psychiatric, then they must accept that the information shared there is not necessarily correct, and that fact should be clear to the participants.
I too believe that lithium and lamictal are possibly redundant!!
;-)
I'm just being a smart *ss there
Posted by mtdewcmu on April 13, 2011, at 22:46:57
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards » mtdewcmu, posted by sleepygirl2 on April 13, 2011, at 21:26:35
> I too believe that lithium and lamictal are possibly redundant!!Yeah. Obviously that's beside the point. I would not stake my life on that statement, it was just idle thinking out loud.
I can sort of see why they are super-cautious over there, seeing as how they have a lot of bipolars and schizophrenics (and combinations of the two) and some of them might be highly suggestible and stop their meds, wind up psychotic, and get themselves killed. Dr Bob's seems to attract mostly treatment-resistant depressives, who have been around psychiatry a while, and are likely not going to stop a med on some stranger's advice, have a symptom, and commit suicide. But this girl stated that she was a treatment-resistant depressive who was having side effects and was considering dumping her pdoc because he/she would not listen to her concerns. So I stand by my post. And I can't deal with a site that is run like some kind of Soviet gulag.
Posted by Phillipa on April 14, 2011, at 0:26:27
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by mtdewcmu on April 13, 2011, at 22:46:57
I think I remember when here we were supposed to add ask your pdoc or consult or call. That seems to have changed. I have visited other boards and didn't like the format of the threads. Hence stay at babble. Phillipa
Posted by mtdewcmu on April 14, 2011, at 1:08:56
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards » mtdewcmu, posted by Phillipa on April 14, 2011, at 0:26:27
One of the admins also called me "ignorant" and said I was insulting autistic people because I said autism causes social difficulties and described some of them. I know there is a movement that thinks autism is a good thing and no one can say anything bad about it without being accused of being a chauvinist. People used to say it was a disease, but I guess they only said that because they were Nazis. I have nothing against autistic people. Really. I do hate overweening and precious discussion board admins, though. I wish I hadn't even looked.
Posted by sigismund on April 14, 2011, at 2:16:29
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by mtdewcmu on April 14, 2011, at 1:08:56
Human attempts at social control are predictable, ubiquitous and dreary.
You should have been on safe ground saying autistic people suffer social difficulties...it is close to the essence of it.
Posted by Tabitha on April 14, 2011, at 5:55:33
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by mtdewcmu on April 13, 2011, at 22:46:57
> Dr Bob's seems to attract mostly treatment-resistant depressives, who have been around psychiatry a while,
Intriguing observation. Hmmm.
Posted by SLS on April 14, 2011, at 7:42:44
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards » mtdewcmu, posted by sleepygirl2 on April 13, 2011, at 21:26:35
> either way, if they've got an "open" forum to discuss things psychological/psychiatric, then they must accept that the information shared there is not necessarily correct, and that fact should be clear to the participants.
>
> I too believe that lithium and lamictal are possibly redundant!!
> ;-)
> I'm just being a smart *ss there
Just to inject my 2 cents worth, I am absolutely sure that lithium and lamotrigine are not redundant. They can act as mutual augmenters, especially in bipolar disorder where rapid cycling is extant.This is, of course, not the crux of the issue. That we have the privilege to offer antagonistic opinions suggests a certain amount of freedom of expression and equality. How else would the synthesis of new, and possibly life-saving ideas occur? I like it here, especially when the civility police keep a low profile.
- Scott
Posted by mtdewcmu on April 14, 2011, at 8:28:44
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards » sleepygirl2, posted by SLS on April 14, 2011, at 7:42:44
> Just to inject my 2 cents worth, I am absolutely sure that lithium and lamotrigine are not redundant. They can act as mutual augmenters, especially in bipolar disorder where rapid cycling is extant.
>I don't know if you read my other long messages in this thread, but this person stated she did not have any kind of bipolar. She was c/o TRD or double depression or chronic depression (her words), and she made it clear that she was not happy with her treatment, was having side effects, and she said that the pdoc would never listen to her when she suggested stopping a med and just kept adding more. She was specifically asking if she was on "too many meds" and was thinking about firing her pdoc.
Don't you agree that in this context, of someone who is taking two drugs normally used in a different disorder and neither of them is working very well, that you could say that they are "possibly redundant?"
*Not to give you a hard time, Scott. But this whole incident obviously sticks in my craw.
I HATE being called out for victimizing people when I had nothing but good intentions. It really triggers my deep-seated issues.
> This is, of course, not the crux of the issue. That we have the privilege to offer antagonistic opinions suggests a certain amount of freedom of expression and equality. How else would the synthesis of new, and possibly life-saving ideas occur? I like it here, especially when the civility police keep a low profile.
>This is quite true, and I infinitely prefer the style here. Why not just put some boilerplate disclaimer on the web page, without making everybody hedge everything they say just in case it be mistaken for medical advice?
I feel like I've probably amply made my point already and I'm beating a dead horse. But what is an internet discussion board other than a farm full of dead horses, all being beaten?
Posted by SLS on April 14, 2011, at 10:02:56
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by mtdewcmu on April 14, 2011, at 8:28:44
> > Just to inject my 2 cents worth, I am absolutely sure that lithium and lamotrigine are not redundant. They can act as mutual augmenters, especially in bipolar disorder where rapid cycling is extant.
> >
>
> I don't know if you read my other long messages in this thread, but this person stated she did not have any kind of bipolar. She was c/o TRD or double depression or chronic depression (her words), and she made it clear that she was not happy with her treatment, was having side effects, and she said that the pdoc would never listen to her when she suggested stopping a med and just kept adding more. She was specifically asking if she was on "too many meds" and was thinking about firing her pdoc.
>
> Don't you agree that in this context, of someone who is taking two drugs normally used in a different disorder and neither of them is working very well, that you could say that they are "possibly redundant?"
>
> *Not to give you a hard time, Scott. But this whole incident obviously sticks in my craw.
>
> I HATE being called out for victimizing people when I had nothing but good intentions. It really triggers my deep-seated issues.
>
> > This is, of course, not the crux of the issue. That we have the privilege to offer antagonistic opinions suggests a certain amount of freedom of expression and equality. How else would the synthesis of new, and possibly life-saving ideas occur? I like it here, especially when the civility police keep a low profile.
> >
>
> This is quite true, and I infinitely prefer the style here. Why not just put some boilerplate disclaimer on the web page, without making everybody hedge everything they say just in case it be mistaken for medical advice?
>
> I feel like I've probably amply made my point already and I'm beating a dead horse. But what is an internet discussion board other than a farm full of dead horses, all being beaten?
Can you provide any evidence to prove your contention that lithium and lamictal are redundant in unipolar MDD such that no one with this diathesis has ever profited from including both lithium and lamotrigine in their treatment regime? You might be right, but I am interested to know what has you so convinced that such a person does not exist. I have a problem with reducing someone else's options by discounting a proposed treatment that might have a chance to work. I have learned not to be so smart.
- Scott
Posted by mtdewcmu on April 14, 2011, at 11:40:19
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by SLS on April 14, 2011, at 10:02:56
>
> Can you provide any evidence to prove your contention that lithium and lamictal are redundant in unipolar MDD such that no one with this diathesis has ever profited from including both lithium and lamotrigine in their treatment regime? You might be right, but I am interested to know what has you so convinced that such a person does not exist. I have a problem with reducing someone else's options by discounting a proposed treatment that might have a chance to work. I have learned not to be so smart.
>I said that I would not stake my life on that statement and it was just idle thinking out loud. This person was not considering mixing them, she had already been taking them, and they were clearly not doing what she wanted. Sorry if I sound like a smarty-pants. I have opinions and put them out there. I'm going to stop beating this horse.
Posted by sleepygirl2 on April 14, 2011, at 17:25:30
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards » SLS, posted by mtdewcmu on April 14, 2011, at 11:40:19
My guess is that you posted this here because you wanted not to debate the truth of your expressed opinion, but to say your intentions were good. Maybe also to say that if there is an online forum where discussion about meds is allowed that one cannot expect views expressed to be facts, but rather the discussion of ideas/impressions/speculations.
"possibly"?? ;-)
IMHO that's just fine
To assume more responsibility than that is to treat the other as someone who cannot consider for themselves. Rightly so (at times and in treatment settings), but this isn't treatment. It is a peer to peer, patient to patient forum.
'nuff said
Be well
Posted by mtdewcmu on April 14, 2011, at 17:42:41
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards » mtdewcmu, posted by sleepygirl2 on April 14, 2011, at 17:25:30
> My guess is that you posted this here because you wanted not to debate the truth of your expressed opinion, but to say your intentions were good. Maybe also to say that if there is an online forum where discussion about meds is allowed that one cannot expect views expressed to be facts, but rather the discussion of ideas/impressions/speculations.
Yeah. Basically. And maybe to get some support after being mistreated.
Posted by sleepygirl2 on April 14, 2011, at 19:50:26
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by mtdewcmu on April 14, 2011, at 17:42:41
Sounds like good reasons. I am sorry about how you were treated.
Take care
Posted by g_g_g_unit on April 15, 2011, at 9:14:30
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards » sleepygirl2, posted by SLS on April 14, 2011, at 7:42:44
Hmm, I wonder if we were hanging out on the same board. I was actually on the verge of posting my experience here, just because it threw into relief how great (read: non-judgmental, totalitarian, etc.) this place is ..
Anyway, I asking for - rather than giving - advice about medication side-effects, but instead ended up with people challenging me on my diagnosis, questioning my doc's expertise, etc.
Posted by floatingbridge on April 17, 2011, at 0:51:56
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by mtdewcmu on April 14, 2011, at 17:42:41
> Yeah. Basically. And maybe to get some support after being mistreated.Lol!
Posted by floatingbridge on April 17, 2011, at 1:37:02
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by g_g_g_unit on April 15, 2011, at 9:14:30
I did post for a short interval on a ptsd board. It was very different. Felt much more remote, less real time. The owner did a pretty good job, imo, of running a tight ship w/ his agenda. Uncivil posts
were just axed. Period. And promptly. No long hanging tangles. I did like that, considering it was a ptsd board. I mean the guy and his admin showed up promptly and the applied the rules
evenly. No humiliating rephrasing cached by Google.They were also very particular about grammar. No slang (now define that, please). No substituting 2 for to. Writer's block.
Then I posted for an even shorter interval (two hours) on a depression and trauma board and someone 'friended'
me instantly (well, with my permission), and I realized they were brawling--and a male identified poster used such deplorable language toward a female
identified poster, and debates about who was bluffing, who was a ×#*%# baby, who had 'real' trauma. It really was the abuse board. (Monty Python: you want to
complain!) In a pique of anxiety I deleted
my account and the attached email address to boot. Whew. I admit to leaving anarchy to the anarchists.
Posted by ron1953 on April 19, 2011, at 19:26:09
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by floatingbridge on April 17, 2011, at 1:37:02
Honesty is to be avoided all all costs. It's that simple.
Posted by SLS on April 20, 2011, at 6:53:51
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by ron1953 on April 19, 2011, at 19:26:09
> Honesty is to be avoided all all costs. It's that simple.
Who are you referring to when you opine on the avoidance of honesty?
- Scott
Posted by ron1953 on April 20, 2011, at 9:07:23
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by SLS on April 20, 2011, at 6:53:51
> > Honesty is to be avoided all all costs. It's that simple.
>
> Who are you referring to when you opine on the avoidance of honesty?
>
>
> - ScottGotta love the Temperance Brennans of the world.....
Posted by SLS on April 20, 2011, at 9:13:23
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards, posted by ron1953 on April 20, 2011, at 9:07:23
> > > Honesty is to be avoided all all costs. It's that simple.
> >
> > Who are you referring to when you opine on the avoidance of honesty?
> >
> >
> > - Scott
>
> Gotta love the Temperance Brennans of the world.....That is an obscure and evasive way of addressing my question. It is almost as if you are avoiding honesty.
- Scott
Posted by ron1953 on April 20, 2011, at 9:24:26
In reply to Re: Scolds on other psychiatry boards » ron1953, posted by SLS on April 20, 2011, at 9:13:23
> > > > Honesty is to be avoided all all costs. It's that simple.
> > >
> > > Who are you referring to when you opine on the avoidance of honesty?
> > >
> > >
> > > - Scott
> >
> > Gotta love the Temperance Brennans of the world.....
>
> That is an obscure and evasive way of addressing my question. It is almost as if you are avoiding honesty.
>
>
> - ScottWhat is it that you want from me, Scott? I don't feel like playing your games. And I'll probably not respond to same in the future, as it is absolutely pointless. If my posts make no sense to you, or you don't like them, so be it. Just ignore them.
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