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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by JeffSmith on December 29, 2006, at 3:15:17
Hi Everyone,
I'll try to make this a short as possible, but Im sure it will still be long so I practically beg that you read it and perhaps try to help/advise me. I know its only a matter of time before I eventually kill myself... I am an absolute mental/emotional wreck and my (so called) "life" has turned out to be a living hell from which I cannot escape.
Let me start with where I am at today: Im 37 and am now (and have literally always been) extremely depressed and unbelievably crippled by anxiety. I am the definition of the word "recluse": I have spent the past 11 years (since 1995) sitting in the house I live in and ONLY leaving when absolutely necessary- which equates to "only leaving the house about once per month to see my 'therapist' and do some necessary shopping (up until 2000 I used to see my shrink once a week)". The only other time I go outside of my house is several times a year when (only out of guilt) Ill see my family members. My roomate/friend is the only friend/social contact Ive had since 1995. I have no internet contacts and rarely talk to family on the phone. I havent had sexual/intimate contact with anyone in the past 11 years either. I have not worked a "real" job since I was 21 and have not worked any job since I was 24 or 25. Ive been on social security/disability since 1995: I get $700 per month. Its almost impossible to survive on that and if I didnt live in my friends house I would never ever be able to care for myself financially (or emotionally, or socially) and would absolutely be the type to go homeless- something Id choose to die over rather than doing so I would absolutely kill myself at that point. My "life" consists of literally nothing but sleeping then getting up and sitting in a chair, reading the internet, listening to some radio, watching TV and hangin with my cats... all day everyday... for all these years. The only exercise I get is an hour a day when I force myself to use my elliptical machine. My misery is profound. I dont know how much longer I can live like this and I wish everyday that I would just easily die so that I dont have to end up killing myself. I really cant believe Ive managed to hold on this long and live this many years in sheer misery... and as time goes by Im running out of reasons/rationalizations to not kill myself.
So how was my life before 1995 and my self imposed isolation? Almost as bad as it is now. I like to categorize my life into four convenient sections: #1-Birth to about seventh grade. #2-About seventh grade to about age 21. #3- Age 21 to about age 25. #4- Age 25 to the present.
#1. From birth till about seventh grade I was a very depressed kid with major social anxiety. My parents were useless as parents. It was all dysfunctional, but nothing really noteworthy of mentioning now.
#2. From about grade seven all the way through high school was the same: Again, extreme depression and unimaginable social anxiety. I hung out with several people and had a few "friends" sporadically but was basically a recluse all then as well. I was (and am) gay but because I always felt such social anxiety, unbelievable low self esteem and merciless criticism of myself physically (from myself) I was never able to even attempt to engage in any physical/sexual intimacy until I was almost 21 years old. In high school I was extremely skinny... just skin and bones with no muscle tone and I felt very ugly as well. In my mind (and probably in reality) there was no possibility that someone could have found me sexually appealing... and even if they did I was so utterly crippled by my anxiety and convinced how physically repulsive I was that there was no way I couldve ever engaged in any physical contact with any guy.
I could not pay attention in school due to the depression and anxiety, I learned nothing, I cut out all the time and was put in "resource room" (for all the derelicts) but finally managed to graduate a year late. I had a job for a couple months during school and one for a couple months after graduation but I was fired from both. I was so young and immature, mentally ill and in such pain I was barely able to function in life, let alone a job. At age 19 I enrolled in community college and went for two semesters.
#3. At almost 21 years old I was seriously planning on suicide but by that time I had gained weight so for once I wasnt a skeleton, my skin looked better and so did I... I finally felt just good/deserving/worthy enough of sex with another person so I decided that before I died I was going to attempt to meet a guy for at least sex and hopefully a relationship.
I got very drunk and met a guy (boring story of how so Ill skip it) who was up to my standards- meaning he was not ugly but not someone I would ever had touched had I not been drunk. I was only comfortable with guys who werent attractive/who I wasnt attracted to so I allowed myself my first sexual experience with this guy. I dont like being drunk and I wanted nothing to do with this guy sexually so after that night we just remained "friends". He constantly tried to get me to fool around with him and was apparently very attracted to me. He brought me to gay bars where I soon discovered that there were a good number of guys who thought I was actually "hot"!! I was even offered $150 by some guy to fool around with him. I declined but I very soon started to hang out in this "hustler" bar/restaurant in NYC where I immediately started to accept offers of good/decent money in exchange for "sex". These were older guys who I wasnt attracted to so I refused to kiss them and did very little else sexually with them yet they still paid me good money. It was all so new and unbelievable to me that people/men actually found me attractive and charming enough that theyd actually pay to be with me. This was probably the first and only time in my life when I felt good a bout myself. Extremely shallow? Yes. But its all I had to feel good about myself and my life.
At about the same time I started to "hustle" (almost 21 years old) I had also met another guy (separate from the hustler bar) who I developed my first and only "romantic" relationship with. He was attractive but not to the point where I felt I wasnt able to socialize with him (in any way): We really bonded fast and strongly. I had been living at home with my parents but a few months after I met (Ill call him "John") they moved across country. My choices were to either move with them or become homeless. John invited me to come live with him... in his mothers house. I decided to do so as Id rather have been dead than to have moved with my parents. We remained romantically involved for several months but I really wasnt sexually attracted to him so our relationship evolved into a sexless, weird co-dependant one where we were basically like a couple with no physical contact.
Also at this period of time I also decided to go back to community college: My sister had given me her very old car so I was (for the first time) able to drive around. In school I met a couple old high school "friends" who were also attending classes there and through them I even developed a bit of a social life. And this is how it went for about the next 3 years: I continued to make some money by hustling, I continued at community college (yes, I was there for several years before earning enough credits to ALMOST graduate), I lived with John and had some "friends" and social outlets. During this time I attempted to fool around with several guys I was attracted to (at separate times) but I always needed to be drunk to go through with it and even then there was NO pleasure due to the fact that my mind was in constant panic and I was as tense as a person about to be executed. I started seeing a shrink at about this time too: I was barely making enough money to live on and couldnt afford one so I had to see one who was picked for me at a local hospital. He gave me prozac but after a few months I realized it was doing nothing for me and neither was talking to this guy every week, so I stopped doing both.
And then as quickly as this small semblance of a "life" I had managed to develop started it began to fall apart basically all at once: First the bar where I was hustling at abruptly just closed. It was the only bar of its kind in NYC. I attempted to join escort services but nobody wanted me: They wanted guys with muscles and I had none. My money source was gone. Then my car completely died and I could no way afford to fix it or buy a new one so I was forced to sell it for junk. I had ALMOST earned enough credits to graduate from community college: All I needed was 1 credit/two classes of PE but I couldnt bring myself to do this. I had/have many specificities over where and when I was/am too panicked/anxiety ridden to be able to handle a situation and be able to function... and Phys Ed was waaaaay off my list. I could handle sitting quietly in class to a certain degree but having to interact w/ a bunch of guys in PE was just out of the question. So I had to wait until I turned 30 in order to actually apply to graduate since PE isnt required at that age.
I also couldnt handle the thought of getting a real job: I knew at a job I wouldnt be able to arrange things my way to where I was in the least amount of anxiety/panic/mental trauma and Id have to be around people who I undoubtedly would be extremely anxiety ridden by at all times... I just couldnt find the nerve to even try, so what did I do? I applied for and was granted welfare, and my life has been nothing but a demeaning, degrading downward spiral ever since.
My supposed "friends" had finished this school by then and were beginning to judge me harshly over my life. They were moving on to jobs, other schools and getting their lives together and I was falling apart. I knew what they thought of me: I was an absolute "loser" to them. I didnt need "friends" in my life who judged and couldnt understand me so I dropped them. They were the last "friends" I was to have. Around this time I also met a guy who I had a very brief relationship with. This guy I WAS attracted to and so this meant that I (of course) could not handle any physical/sexual contact with him. My life was a disaster and I had completely lost any semblance of self esteem I had managed to grasp in the previous few years: I had to end this relationship due to these reasons. I just couldnt take the anxiety and I gave up on trying to deal with it. This was the last physical/sexual/intimate contact I was to have till this day.
#4. And so this began the fourth and current phase of my "life". John was to be the only person to remain in my life and care about me (aside from my family). Johns mother also owns another house and at that time in 1995 she allowed John and I to move into it (this is the house I still live in since then). I had decided to try my best to get some mental help in an attempt to live a normal, healthy, productive life before it was too late. I was accepted for social security/disability (and discontinued the "welfare") which I am (fortunately or unfortunately) still on. I found a "guidance center" where I saw a shrink (social worker to be precise) from 1995-2000. Id go each week which was no easy feat for I had to walk to the train station, take a train, then walk to the center all while my social anxiety/panic only worsened and worsened. After some time I realized I was getting absolutely nowhere with her (my shrink). I was also taking paxil (prescribed by a Dr. at the center) by then but I felt no better and the "therapy" was honestly just a waste of time. I spent five years pouring my heart out, telling her every conceivable thing about me but it was useless: Id talk and talk and talk and she'd say very, very little. I wanted so bad to just quit going to see her but the fact is I felt too guilty to do so... I didnt want to "hurt her feelings". Plus I felt this was the only opportunity I had to see someone who might be able to help me and I was clinging to that hope that she could help. Well after five years (almost) she decided to leave the guidance center in order to open up her own practice... we had our last session and that was that. It was a sad event since I grew to really like her as a person, even though her therapy was useless, but I was honestly so relieved. Ive chosen to not see a therapist since then. I dont trust that Ill ever get someone remotely qualified to help me at this dump I go to (for several reasons).
Since my shrink left in 2000 I have been seeing (on a monthly basis) the nurse practitioner there: Ive been on prozac and paxil which did nothing but make me fat so Ill never take another SSRI again. Ive been on Wellbutrin and Klonopin (Clonazepam) for some time now but theyre also useless. She even had me on Abilify (an anti psychotic) for about a year because I asked for something to help with major anger. A few months ago I told her I wanted to start weaning off of it (I hated the way it made me feel) but she had the nerve to tell me I should continue to take the dose she prescribed: Rather than try to assert myself by telling her "no, I will not take it" I just allow her to write me the RX and then I just dont get it filled. Ive pretty much become convinced that medication is not the answer to any of my issues, but I still take the other two for fear of stopping.
What you just read has essentially been my whole life/lack of one and I am profoundly devastated over it and over the fact that I can see virtually no possible way out of this life other than suicide. My entire life has been literally wasted, Ive accomplished next to nothing and Ive missed out on everything, everything and everything else. Im rapidly running out of time as Im 37 now and have no desire to grow old. I wish to just find some mental peace, happiness, a career and a lover (or even just some casual sex) but I have a million obstacles keeping me from that and most of the obstacles are things that I dont see ever being able to change before Im too old and its too late.
I have virtually no work experience and I know how to do nothing: How am I supposed to ever get a decent job and career? Im terrified that Ill never be able to support myself. If John dies (or threw me out) Id be homeless with no possessions, no way to support myself, waaay too many cats and no hope. Again theres a million unmovable obstacles in the way of me working/finding a career.
The simple act of opening the front door to retrieve the mail from the box is something I can only do at night: I wont do it during the daylight since Im terrified that the neighbors will see me... they know Im a hermit and the fear of how theyre judging me over that (and over many other things) keeps me from allowing them to see me. The fear of what everyone is thinking about me/judging me over is the most overwhelming and damaging aspect of my mental problems and keeps me from all socialization. There's just so many intricate, crazy problems in my head/personality that I could spend days here detailing them but I am trying to keep this short.
I know I desperately need psychological help and life guidance if there is to be any hope of me ever getting any better and achieving any happiness but I also know that finding this help is going to be next to impossible mostly due to the fact that I have no money. No matter how much time I spend trying to figure out how Im going to get out of my misery I always end up with the same conclusion which is that unless a "miracle" occurs then Im never going to get out without killing myself. I dont know how much more of this "life" I can take before I cant take it anymore: Ive been in such pain and misery for so long (literally forever but more so as more time passes) that its all that I know and I fear that I WILL be able to tolerate this exact life for perhaps years more to come before I finally end it.
So why am I writing here? Because I clearly dont have anyone to turn to for help or advice. Im just desperately hoping someone here will be able to give me any miracle answer/advise. Tell me how I can find a good qualified shrink with little to no money who can actually help me. What else can I possibly do to get better? Is there anyone here who will rescue me from my life?
Thanks for reading all this.
Posted by Tamar on December 29, 2006, at 6:32:10
In reply to PLEASE Read This And Help Me... Please., posted by JeffSmith on December 29, 2006, at 3:15:17
Hi Jeff, and welcome to Babble!
I read your post and I’m sorry that things have been so difficult for you for such a long time.
I wish I could rescue you or provide a miracle for you, but sadly these things are outside my abilities. But I can certainly understand why you want a miracle or a rescue.
I doubt this is what you want to hear, but in my experience, miracles don’t really work. They give us plenty of good feelings, but they don’t inevitably lead to long term change. Even if you suddenly came into a fortune it wouldn’t make you less anxious; even if you found a wonder drug it wouldn’t cure you overnight. And even if you had the best therapist in the world, s/he couldn’t make you better without a lot of hard work on your part.
As for rescuing you… it sounds to me as if John has stepped up to the mark there. You have a roof over your head and someone who cares about you. It sounds to me as if you’re already being rescued. But of course it’s not a permanent fix for all your difficulties.
When things feel really bad it’s natural to want large-scale permanent change. Of course you want a miracle. In fact, though, things can seem a lot better with only very small changes. And making a lot of small changes over a period of time can eventually feel like a transformation. So don’t give up! I’d suggest you set your sights a little lower than a miracle and start with trying to achieve something much smaller.
And: give yourself credit for what you have managed to achieve! You have formed lasting relationships, you have graduated from college - so what if you couldn’t do PE? If my degree had depended on my sporting abilities I wouldn’t have graduated either. And you have taken some responsibility for your health by trying meds and therapy. I know you feel it hasn’t helped, but I think it’s very good that you have tried those things. I also think it’s good that you exercise every day; exercise can help a little.
Do you eat healthily? Do you drink enough water? These are things you can address without even leaving the house.
Sometimes when things are awful it really does feel like you’re just hanging on from one hour to the next, one day to the next. There isn’t an instant solution to that experience. But it doesn’t mean things will always feel this way. You talk about worrying that it’s too late at age 37 for your life to change; well I’m the same age as you. I don’t think life is over yet. We still have half our years in front of us. And believe it or not people do build new careers and new partnerships in middle age and beyond. My grandfather remarried after the death of my grandmother, when he was in his 70s, and his second wife was 15 years younger than he was and quite wealthy. So even at twice your age people can find contentment.
Having read your story, it sounds to me as if dealing with your anxiety is probably the first step; relationships and employment will be easier to find if you’re feeling more mentally healthy. Also, a good relationship and a good job won’t cure anyone of anxiety or depression (as I know only too well). So I really think it starts with addressing your mental health difficulties. And that’s not easy; it takes time and hard work. But you sound like a determined person, and I reckon you can do it.
I hope things get better for you soon. Keep posting and let us know how you’re doing.
Tamar
Posted by ClearSkies on December 29, 2006, at 8:49:48
In reply to PLEASE Read This And Help Me... Please., posted by JeffSmith on December 29, 2006, at 3:15:17
Hello, and welcome, Jeff. Most of us found PsychoBabble when we were at our bottom, too. The main thing to remember here is that we are your peers; we'll suggest what has worked for us and maybe have some ideas you haven't yet considered. I find it an invaluable site for support.
I went through trying many antidepressants before arriving at my present prescription (which is working, um, OK for the most part but I'm still kind of a mess). It sounds like your antidepressant isn't working for you. Unfortunately, or fortunately, depending on how you look at it, there are lots of other choices out there to experiment with - oops, I meant to try out :-)
As to finding the appropriate therapist, for me it was trial and error. Many errors. Eventually I decided that it was like a job interview, where I was the person looking for the right candidate. There are different approaches to therapy and from what my therapist told me, she uses the technique that she feels has the best chance for being successful.
So, I know there is hope for you, Jeff. It helps me to post here when I am doing badly, and it also helps me to post in support of others who are having a difficult time.
I'm ClearSkies, BTW. Nice to meet you!
Posted by madeline on December 29, 2006, at 11:01:55
In reply to PLEASE Read This And Help Me... Please., posted by JeffSmith on December 29, 2006, at 3:15:17
Welcome to babble jeff. I'm glad you came here, it certainly has helped me a lot.
I read your story from start to finish and have the following things to say.
(1) I see a lot of reason for hope in your story, as other posters have indicated, look what you have accomplished so far and look at what you had to fight to get there. Your comittment to exercise also tells me that you care enough about yourself to be healthy. There is a very very strong person in there who can beat this yet.
(2) When things are bad, I tend to pile every single bad thing that has ever happened to me right into a big heap in my mind. However, I have found this really doesn't help. It just created for me more pain. By summarizing your life like that, it appears to me you are doing the same thing I do (very common by the way, you are in very good company). Instead of doing that, let's just break things down into manageable, acheivable goals and go from there.
(3) Let's get this anxiety under control. Paxil, in certain, instances can make anxiety worse, I would either talk to your pdoc or post over on the drug board to get some pharmacological options that maybe you haven't explored.
(4) We've got to get you out of the house. It doesn't sound as though you have progressed to frank agoraphobia (SP?), but maybe we should approach it as though you have.
One thing that helps with phobias is to just face them in metered doses. This may sound absolutely insane, but I am afraid of the mail. I would let it pile up, bills go past due, all sorts of badness. I used to think that I had to get ALL of the mail at once, but i don't, I started just getting one or two pieces of mail a day. Then advanced from there. I mean, you don't have to go and spend the whole night out, but maybe a five minute trip the library, or a bar in the afternoon where it won't be as crowded. Say "i'm going to the movies, but just for the previews and then I'm leaving." Then, if you feel more comfortable, you can stay longer.(5) Let's work on forgiving yourself the things you say are holding you back and let's find ways to be less harsh on yourself. Look, we all live our lives the best way we can. Most people don't have the baggage we have and can't even fathom what is in our minds. If they did, then the majority of them would be a lot less judgemental. You know what is in your mind, you know what you have suffered, now grant yourself permission to understand and accept yourself. You are the way you are, and for right now, that is more than enough. It is more than enough. Right now at this moment you are more than enough.
(6) Finally (whew! I'm sorry i'm so long winded, but your story really touched me). While you are on the way to recovery, I would try to take a little baby step everyday toward the stated things you wanted - career, love etc.... I wouldn't start by thinking of all the things you can't do, but start by thinking of things that you sort of like to do. Then visualize yourself successfully doing them. It doesn't matter whether or not you think you can do them, just visualize yourself actually doing them.
I'm here to help and I don't always lecture (sorry, you can just ignore all this if you like) as are the people at babble.
Keep us posted (pardon the pun)
Maddie
Posted by Poet on December 29, 2006, at 11:09:17
In reply to PLEASE Read This And Help Me... Please., posted by JeffSmith on December 29, 2006, at 3:15:17
Hi Jeff,
I'm glad you found babble, you'll like it here.
My therapist works on a sliding scale, when the insurance runs out I pay her what I can, which is about half of what she normally charges. You might try calling your local mental health association and see if they have a list of therapists who work on a sliding scale.
Where I am there is a very active gay, lesbian, bi, and transgender community organization. Maybe there's something similar where you are and they could help you find a therapist.
I'm sorry you wasted so many years with a therapist who wasn't a good match. I lucked out and found a good one on the first try.
The nurse practitioner needs to know you aren't taking the meds, it's okay to write it down and hand it to her if you can't get her to listen. My first pdoc was over medicating me, the second one, despite that I call her Dr. Clueless, actually listened to me and now I'm on the lowest dose of Effexor XR. Your nurse practioner needs to know about your fear of weight gain, I'm bulimic, and would never take anything that causes weight gain, so I totally get why you don't like Paxil or Prozac. Have you ever been on any anti anxiety meds? I've been taking clonzaepam and it's helped my social anxiety and test anxiety (I'm taking classes.) It got me through Christmas with my family.
I hope I helped a little bit.
Poet
Posted by inimitable on December 29, 2006, at 14:45:21
In reply to Re: PLEASE Read This And Help Me... Please. » JeffSmith, posted by Poet on December 29, 2006, at 11:09:17
i don't have much time right now, but jeffsmith, i wanted to say that it's great that you got the courage to come to babble and talk about this! because i remember reading your message that you have no internet contacts, yet you still managed to talk to us all about your life, that seems very courageous on your behalf!
this is a good place to come to, every time i've needed support or even just to tell my story, this place has been great for that, so come again, many times!
*inimitable
Posted by JeffSmith on December 29, 2006, at 19:42:24
In reply to Re: PLEASE Read This And Help Me... Please., posted by inimitable on December 29, 2006, at 14:45:21
I really appreciate that you all took the time to read my saga and then reply w/ suggestions. Its definitely humiliating to reveal all of that about myself and I feared (and honestly still fear) that some of you may harshly judge me for whatever reason... but Im very much comforted by the fact that all you guys have your own issues (like who doesnt?). Ive been reading some of the posts here and its just nice to know that you can understand and perhaps relate to me and I to you.
And just so you know: I have a real "people pleasing" problem which I despise. Im always horrified of the thought that someone will get pissed off at me, dislike me or be unnecessarily offended if I said exactly how I feel- so Ive always found myself holding back a lot of my true feelings. As I said, I despise doing this and Id love to just be my blunt, honest, angry, depressed self here if I could without fear of being hated. So Ill attempt to do so and just hope for the best.
So right now the truth is that Im overwhelmed by the thought of responding individually to each point each person wrote to me in reply to my message. To do so would require so much more thinking and then writing which takes me a ridiculous amount of time/mental energy and (of course) fills me w/ anxiety. Id rather not deal with all that anxiety right now so I will put off responding to individuals until later.
Please do not be offended if I dont write a huge reply to everyone... and dont be offended if I dont reply to everything you said- or even if I dont reply to anything at all.
Thanks for hopefully understanding this, and thanks again especially for all the replys.
Jeff
Posted by ClearSkies on December 29, 2006, at 19:57:10
In reply to Thanks Everyone..., posted by JeffSmith on December 29, 2006, at 19:42:24
Please don't feel obliged to reply to every (or any, for that matter) post. I too have a wicked people-pleasing aspect that I feel humiliated by.
take care
CS
Posted by inimitable on December 29, 2006, at 20:13:00
In reply to Re: Thanks Everyone... » JeffSmith, posted by ClearSkies on December 29, 2006, at 19:57:10
don't worry about replying seperatly to me either jeffsmith, i don't feel you "owe" me anything like that. i think many of us are just glad that you actually came here. i don't really have much to offer in some people's situations, but when i read something that touches me, i like to reply, just for the reason that that person's post touched me, not because i can't wait for them to respond to my reply!
well i must go now, but again, keep coming back here! :)*inimitable
Posted by madeline on December 30, 2006, at 5:40:37
In reply to Thanks Everyone..., posted by JeffSmith on December 29, 2006, at 19:42:24
AS the other posters have indicated you don't have to reply to any post on babble.
The way I see it, that's really not how babble works. Sometimes just getting it all out is enough.
I tend to be a "little miss fix it" and miss the fact that sometimes we just want to get the inside out.
Thank you so much for sharing your story with us, it really touched me and resonated with me.
You are definately not alone anymore.
Maddie
Posted by JeffSmith on December 31, 2006, at 8:49:28
In reply to Re: Thanks Everyone... » JeffSmith, posted by madeline on December 30, 2006, at 5:40:37
For being so understanding. : )
I can only talk about myself so much before I need to retreat and I just didnt want anyone to think I didnt appreciate or value their advice, opinions or experiences by not replying.Id still love to stick around here though as I love all the analytical talk Ive been reading...
Im impossible at helping myself w/ my own mess of a life but I still love to think Im good at playing amateur shrink for other peoples issues. : )
I love finding out how other peoples minds work and what makes them tick.
Posted by muffled on December 31, 2006, at 15:14:55
In reply to Thanks Again Folks, posted by JeffSmith on December 31, 2006, at 8:49:28
> Id still love to stick around here though as I love all the analytical talk Ive been reading...
> I love finding out how other peoples minds work and what makes them tick.
>
**LOL!!! You in the right place then!
Good to have you on board!
Take care,
Muffled
Posted by Phillipa on January 1, 2007, at 12:55:48
In reply to Re: Thanks Again Folks » JeffSmith, posted by muffled on December 31, 2006, at 15:14:55
Please stay you help us all too . We all help each other. Love Phillipa
This is the end of the thread.
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