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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Jellibabe on October 31, 2003, at 1:16:58
I am in so much pain. I love my therapist. I see him as a father. He is about the right age to be too. He has smiley eyes. He is kind, but firm. I told him I love him. I asked him to love me. I know it is not allowed. He was kind about it, told me he is concerned for me, but quite firm about the loving bit. I knew it would be like that.
Sometimes I cut myself when I feel I can't cope and I wish I had the courage to slash my face with the blade because then at least if people were horrified by me, I wouldn't fool myself into thinking that possibly they could love me.
The thing is, I can only afford to see him every two weeks and I die in between appointments. I know it sounds dramatic, but it IS awful. I so look forward to seeing him, but dread the saying goodbye, because it causes such pain and the long wait for the next appointment. I do so want to hug him, but that is not allowed. No touching of any sort.
A lot of the time I lie on my bed and manage to "dream" that he did love me, and how we sit together and talk and laugh about all sorts of different things. I dream that he really is my father. I spend a lot of time in my dreams and sometimes it is easy to really believe it. It makes me happy for a while. What I wanted to ask is - does anyone else do this?
Posted by Elle2021 on October 31, 2003, at 4:46:36
In reply to Anyone else live in their dreams?, posted by Jellibabe on October 31, 2003, at 1:16:58
Hi,
Sorry to hear that you are in such pain. Sometimes I wonder how my life would have turned out if my psychiatrist would have been my father. He is very kind, patient, and laid back. Nothing seems to get him upset (and I can be very stubborn and irritating).
I think your looking for a father figure. I think from your previous post it doesn't seem you are "in love" with him romantically, just depersately wanting that father-daughter connection (me too). I have a habit of being attracted to men who are sometimes 20-40 years older than me. I have no interest in men my own age, I want a protector. Let me know how things are going. Elle
Posted by Elle2021 on October 31, 2003, at 4:48:51
In reply to Re: Anyone else live in their dreams? » Jellibabe, posted by Elle2021 on October 31, 2003, at 4:46:36
I'm sorry, I must correct myself. I thought you said you were in love romantically with your psych, when actually you said nothing about that. I also forgot to mention that I used to cut too. I haven't done it for a while, but under extreme stress I still have the urge. Elle
Posted by Jellibabe on October 31, 2003, at 5:13:29
In reply to Re: Anyone else live in their dreams?--Jellibabe, posted by Elle2021 on October 31, 2003, at 4:48:51
Oh Elle, will we ever get over this? Will I still be looking for a father figure when I am 70 (assuming I get that far).
It's not as if I want anything bad. I just want him to hug me and to love me, even if it is just a little bit. I want to be able to go for walks with him, talk with him, make him tea and bring it to him with love, tell him a joke and make him laugh, and sometimes have him hold my hand.
Those are not bad things, surely. Just daughterly things.I'm trying not to cut at the moment. So far I have managed. Life just seems to be an endless round of pain and cutting and dreams and more pain . . . just constantly trying to escape the pain with little splashes of sunshine every two weeks when I see him.
Posted by Dinah on October 31, 2003, at 7:14:43
In reply to Anyone else live in their dreams?, posted by Jellibabe on October 31, 2003, at 1:16:58
I always try to make my dreams a bit more realistic. They're at their best with us you know. When they're real fathers or lovers or whatever they are every bit as annoying as your average one. Since my transference is maternal in nature, if it gets painful, I carry the fantasy to its logical conclusion. That if he were my mother, we'd fight constantly about clothes and curfews. He'd yell at me and try to manage my life.
I told my therapist that once and he laughed. We both said simultaneously "But then you (I) would be able to yell at me (you)".
There is nothing wrong with fantasies about our therapists. When I'm upset I sometimes fantasize about curling up on my therapist's lap like a cat. In fact, the fantasies can be enjoyable.
But if your fantasies are helping you stay in a state of pain, it might be wiser not to allow yourself to dwell in them. If you could use those times to remember how great what you have with him is, you might be able to shift the fantasy a bit. He's a terrific therapist/daddy. He makes you feel safe. He can hold you with words even if he can't hold you with arms. And he can help you grow, just like a real daddy.
So when I get upset, I imagine being in his office (his old one, not the new one) with him at his most empathetic and able to hold my emotions.
I know how rough the infrequent schedule must be. I've found that I'm doing much better since going to twice a week. I don't get as desperate since it always seems possible to bear the pain for a few days, while a couple of weeks seems likes forever. I'm so sorry that that is necessary for you.
Posted by fallsfall on October 31, 2003, at 7:28:15
In reply to Anyone else live in their dreams?, posted by Jellibabe on October 31, 2003, at 1:16:58
Two weeks is a long time. I can relate to most of what you have said - wanting to love and be loved, but knowing it isn't allowed - wanting to hug (this was one of the hardest for me) - daydreaming - and wanting the parenting so badly (and it seems like they could give it, except for the boundaries...).
Make sure that he knows how much of your real life this is affecting (tell him how many hours you think about him each day), so that he can help you deal with it. What kind of therapy does he do (cognitive behavioral, psychodynamic, eclectic etc)?
I find that if I write it all down that sometimes the thoughts will stick to the page, so I don't have to keep thinking them. I gave all my journalling to my therapist, so she got an idea of what was really going through my head. It was also suggested that I write imaginary letters FROM her To me - what would she say in response to how I was feeing? I didn't write in that direction too often, but I did "hear" her in my head. How long have you been seeing him? If it has been a while, can you predict what he will say to you in a session? If you can, then you can bring him "with" you wherever you go, and he can advise you - that was comforting to me.
You are certainly not the only one!
Posted by Elle2021 on October 31, 2003, at 21:15:51
In reply to Re: Anyone else live in their dreams?--Jellibabe » Elle2021, posted by Jellibabe on October 31, 2003, at 5:13:29
Jellibabe-
I forgot to mention that I also only get to see my psych. once a month. It used to be every two weeks, but I couldn't afford that. And now, I don't get to see him again until Dec. I just had my cat get hit by a car and he died. It has sent me into this awful depression. I wish I could call him up, but I feel like I already call him too often about my medications.So, what do you see your psych. for (if you don't mind my asking)? I'm supposedly Borderline, and I have OCD, GAD, and Panic Disorder, nasty depression. Makes life a real joy. But I make the best of it I guess.
I do really miss my therapist inbetween visits. He is so kind to me and caring.
Elle> Oh Elle, will we ever get over this? Will I still be looking for a father figure when I am 70 (assuming I get that far).
>
> It's not as if I want anything bad. I just want him to hug me and to love me, even if it is just a little bit. I want to be able to go for walks with him, talk with him, make him tea and bring it to him with love, tell him a joke and make him laugh, and sometimes have him hold my hand.
> Those are not bad things, surely. Just daughterly things.
>
> I'm trying not to cut at the moment. So far I have managed. Life just seems to be an endless round of pain and cutting and dreams and more pain . . . just constantly trying to escape the pain with little splashes of sunshine every two weeks when I see him.
>
Posted by Jellibabe on November 3, 2003, at 1:07:16
In reply to Re: Anyone else live in their dreams?--Jellibabe » Jellibabe, posted by Elle2021 on October 31, 2003, at 21:15:51
Dear Elle
I am so sorry about your cat! That is really awful. Cats are such good friends. Do you think you might feel like getting another one at some stage? I love cats so much. With some in particular you can develop such a lovely bond with them. My heart really goes out to you.
I feel bad for moaning about seeing my therapist every two weeks when you only see yours once a month. That must be very tough. For how long have you been seeing your psych. only once a month? Has it been a long time like that?
I am bipolar II with OCD. I get very severely depressed with suicidal tendancies.I am glad your psych. is good to you. He sounds nice, like mine. Mine has smiley eyes and I enjoy making him laugh!
Anyway, don't forget to tell me about your cat, if you are up to it...
Posted by Elle2021 on November 3, 2003, at 1:53:18
In reply to Living in dreams » Elle2021, posted by Jellibabe on November 3, 2003, at 1:07:16
Jellibabe,
Doesn't OCD just totally make things awful. It's so frustrating. I had been going to my psych. every two weeks, but back in Sept? I started seeing him once a month (his idea...). Now he has cancelled my apps. till December. I think I may ask for a referral to a psychologist or a therapist that I can talk to inbetween visits to him. But I really wish I could see him every week. He is so understanding, I bet his kids love him a lot.I have tons of cats. They are all so special to me. I can't explain the companionship they give me. I feed all the strays that come to my door too. But still, it hurts to lose one. I loved him so much. I miss him. Well, before I depress you...I'll quit rambling. Hope to hear from you soon! Elle
Posted by Jellibabe on November 3, 2003, at 2:31:02
In reply to Re: Living in dreams » Jellibabe, posted by Elle2021 on November 3, 2003, at 1:53:18
Dear Elle
I've also got lots of cats. 11 at the moment. Mostly cats that need homes from people leaving for overseas or who are abandoned, etc. They are all special and wonderful, but some of them just have that ability to really just climb into my heart and are just that little bit "extra special" somehow. Although I try never to show it in case any of the others feel hurt!
My OCD is a bit perculiar, I guess you'll think. It is with regard to my minister. Again, old enough to be my father and I love him as a daughter would. I developed an obsession about him. Keep buying him and his wife little presents, flowers, writing them little notes on how much I loved him/them etc.
It got so bad, with the cutting that I even wrote to them in my blood at one stage, to show how greatly I loved them.
They are both very loving and kind and understanding but it all got a bit too much and I had a complete breakdown and admitted to my family what I was doing. (I had hidden it up until then).Anyway, my minister and his wife have been fantastic but I am still obsessive (although less so). The only problem is, is that now he has developed a terrible illness which seems terminal. It worries me greatly, but my psychiatrist has been wonderful in helping me. Do you think that is a wierd story?
The first psychiatrist I went to was absolutely appalled by the story. She said she had never heard of anything so bizarre in her life!! - made me feel like a real freak. Unfortunately, that horrible feeling has stuck inside me, but this message board has given me the courage to open up a little bit - and also my current psychiatrist who is just too fantastic!
Posted by Elle2021 on November 3, 2003, at 3:58:10
In reply to Re: Living in dreams » Elle2021, posted by Jellibabe on November 3, 2003, at 2:31:02
Hi Jellibabe-
Have you ever been diagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder? Your self-cutting is a famous symptom of it. I self-cut too, but not nearly as often as I used to. Haven't done it in quite a while. My psychiatrist said he hopes to make it less frequent rather than completely going away. But for the moment, I don't have the urge. I'm glad you have found a psychiatrist that is understanding. Please don't feel like a freak. Your getting better, we have all done things we aren't particularly proud of.I have 5 strays I'm feeding outside (I hate to refer to them as strays...especially since I have already named them) and 13 inside cats! I love them so much, and I totally agree with you about not saying one is more special than the other. I wouldn't want to hurt their feelings (in case they do happen to understand me, but simply ignore me when I tell them to get off the table, hehe).
Elle
Posted by Jellibabe on November 3, 2003, at 4:15:37
In reply to Re: Living in dreams » Jellibabe, posted by Elle2021 on November 3, 2003, at 3:58:10
Hi Elle
I don't know about Borderline Personality Disorder. What are the other symptoms? I'll try to look on the internet and see if I can find anything about it. My psych says that if I try not to cut, the urge to cut will get less and less. But when devastation happens, the first thing I reach for is a blade ....
Jellibabe
Posted by Dinah on November 3, 2003, at 5:49:17
In reply to Re: Living in dreams » Elle2021, posted by Jellibabe on November 3, 2003, at 2:31:02
I can't believe your first psychiatrist was so unprofessional! If she hadn't heard anything like it, that was a reflection on her lack of breadth of experience, not a reflection on you. And she shouldn't have burdened you with that, but discussed it with her supervisory group.
I'm glad you found a more competent professional. That's even more reason to be completely open with him, don't you think? It sounds as if he can handle it.
Posted by Elle2021 on November 5, 2003, at 1:20:46
In reply to Re: Living in dreams » Elle2021, posted by Jellibabe on November 3, 2003, at 4:15:37
Borderline Personality Disorder is characterized by quickly shifting moods (mood swings), fear of being abandoned, self-mutilation (cutting), black and white thinking, splitting (seeing someone as all good or all bad, idealizing them and then devaluing). A great website to learn more is:
www.borderlinepersonality.ca
I wouldn't recommend the message boards there though.
I know how you feel about reaching for the blade whenever devastation hits...I still fight the urge to cut myself, but I'm getting stronger everyday.
Elle
Posted by Marsel Bennett on November 5, 2003, at 16:46:54
In reply to Anyone else live in their dreams?, posted by Jellibabe on October 31, 2003, at 1:16:58
short and sweet.
i think too many people depend on other people for their happiness. sooner or later any loved one will have to leave, or you leave them...the course of life, things always change.
seems like you have a (time/opportunity fear) problem. what i mean by that, is on the timeline, you are not in the present....you are as you say in the topic, in your dreams..which means the future. the problem with that is you are living 2 lives in parallel, one is your fictional life, the way you would like to have it filling <our time with thoughts promoting this positive fantasy....but your real life is passing by second by second and while you are in a constant state of "tomorrow...(what will happen)" ....the moment you are in, which is the only moment, is gone. but, you are simultaneously aware of this happening which is exactly why you are experiencing the emotion of fear/pain. your actualization never manifests itself....it only gets postponed.
i am going through the same/have been through it.
and it is one of the toughest habits of breaking.
from a programmers perspective the general rule of thumb is..."if you are trying to close a program that is interrupting normal computer operation, but it won't, the only thing left to do is the kill the process." in other words you need a dramatic shock to your system in order to have a real chance of loosing this illusional time/opportunity effect. i suggest sitting down and heavily introverting for a while, do some self-talk...the upside is the self-talk will make its way into your sub-conscious (the child like part of you, controlling you including this habit.both positive and negative self-talk are approapriate. remember that we operate on multiple personalities also....try to figure out what those are for you, and what triggers them to come into the foreground...could be the presence of a person like your therapist...etc.
anyway, enough for now.
This is the end of the thread.
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